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Are more people starting to retire?
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Why does the idea that it is “40% russian laundered money” have anything to do with it. What about the other 60% of people whose personal property is being STOLEN by european foreign bankers. The “russian” tale is a smoke screen to legitimize theft by the very people who are responsible for this mess, ie the financial people who have profitted obscenely on the backs of the average guy.
This is the foot in the door, to wealth taxes elsewhere in southern europe.
Who is to say the US government wont say one day that all doctors have to pay a 5% tax to make up for the professions history of “overbilling”. As I mentioned before to those that say it cant happen here, just ask the chrysler bondholders from 2009.-
Burton
Didn’t expect that response. (fire my financial advisor)
As it happens, I think of that every year, and every year (every one), they beat what I would make on index fund by WAY more than their fees. You should perhaps have had more information before firing.
My point was not to recommend a dollar amount to spend, my point was to let the youngun’s know that your nest egg requirement is far greater than most of them expect, and to give “tips” on retiring early (as requested).
Since you have weighed in with your judgement of my spending habits, you need more information. Our expenses are what they are as a result of balancing our income and our desires. They could certainly be less, and we have considered that, but there is no point in it. We would have more money and we don’t need that. We need to have experiences, and that is what our money buys. I have had a cancer scare, and have had some friends pass away. This affects your understanding of what you want to do with your time on earth, and your plans for using your resources to do that.
Autos are bought with cash only, but you seem to imply that by not having monthly payments, you have avoided a large cost. THEY ARE NOT FREE. Every 5 years (two cars – run each about 10 years) we need to shell out 30-40k. House required 45 k in repairs last year (an unusual year in that regard, but EVERY year is unusual in one way or another and we actually expect “unexpected” expenses of about 30k per year. This year, the bathroom renovation that we will need to do to sell the home is up, and we have budgeted 60k). Our house still has a mortgage for which, after tax, we pay 1.9%. (our mortgage payments are less than my kid pays for rent for an 800sf apartment in the Big City). I do not pay it off, I could write a check to do it, but then I would be withdrawing funds from investments that made more than 15% last year. That would be Dumb. No second home, we rent when we go away for a month. Travel expenses -my kids live on either coast, and I will spend $$ to go be with them, and pay to have them visit us. That is important. My mother in law may soon need an extended care home, and she has no money. (we looked at insurance for this, but as our financial advisor pointed out, it is cheaper simply to pay for it when she needs it.)
Furthermore, among my colleagues (partners) our expenses are among the lowest, if not the lowest.
saying you will spend 100k per year sounds great. Until it runs into reality. And, again, that is part of my message. Your expenses will be higher than you imagine. Plan for it. I have been tracking my expenses for 20 years with quicken, and I understand what our expenses are and understand how, if I needed to, I could reduce them. In particular, it was enlightening early on to see how I had little control over the unexpected expenses, and how they really could only be reduced a certain amount (we did sell the really big house 10 years ago, and avoided much of those costs).
and keep in mind that in 20 years, that 290K will spend like 100k does now. You must save today to factor in inflation
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“As it happens, I think of that every year, and every year (every one), they beat what I would make on index fund by WAY more than their fees. You should perhaps have had more information before firing. ”
Maybe they have you invested in emerging market bonds, frontier market stocks, individual growth stocks and other high risk investments? Have you checked? Comparing these types of investments to a plain vanilla index portfolio of us market, international market and bond portfolio is like comparing apples to oranges. They may have done well for you every year, but the risk they are taking could blow up at any time and take all that away. There is no magic to investing. Active management has been shown to be a loser in multiple academic studies. If I were in your shoes, I would make sure I am taking very little risk since you have already won the game and have enough. You should not be making 15% from the markets since that implies way too much risk for someone like you. Remember if you can make 15% one year, you can lose 50-60%+ in another. Are you ok with that?
And as far as the house goes, how many thousands are you throwing away in interest income every year? There is also no guarantee that the markets will continue to beat 1.9%. Take the sure deal. Plus bury some money away from creditors by paying off your mortgage.
Still am shocked by 290k in expenses for a retiree.
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Again key to retire or at least semi retire early
No debt.
Own your own home outright
Have kids college funded.
Decide what you need for monthly living
I’m a big believer in capital preservation through income generating investments such as stocks that pay increasing dividends and real estate. Tax free muni’s have done great for me too
It’s not without risks. Markets can tumble as we have all seen but it works if you choose wisely and don’t go for the home run every time.
It’s very easy to generate 100k a year off of 3million in assets and even grow your principle
If I want more, I work a few weeks
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kpack, couldn’t have said it better.
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Wis–
When government entities need to increase their revenue, they turn to taxation. In the case of Cyprus, it was a direct tax on bank deposits, including foreign and domestic depositors, with a higher tax on larger accounts. As we see in the US, the Obama administration is contemplating a tax on municipal bond interest for those with an income above the 28% level.
They are not directly the same, I agree. The underlying principle is this: savers and investors must always cast a wary eye on those who propose and decide on fiscal policy at the state and federal level, and try to affect those policies whenever possible. Otherwise, their savings will be extracted in percentages, that accumulate over time. Other proposals are these: income indexing of social security, decreasing mortgage interest deduction for those in the 35% tax level or higher. The common denominator here is the government policy maker’s search for more income to garner more benefits for those who vote for them, at the expense of savers and investors.-
Can we stop equating Cyprus to Obama
That’s irrational and asinine
Also. Just because one thing on Muni’s gets tossed out there don’t act like its already law.
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Ad hominem attack does not equal rational debate.
Why do you not believe that government fiscal and tax policy does not affect your wealth accumulation strategies?
Seems quite logical to me, and the overwelming majority of financial advisors, including almost all those of our colleages above, recommend some attention to it. The proposals I described are out there.
Some of them, including the mortgage deduction item, are supported by GOP members, who are not thinking clearly during this debate, I believe.
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@Rad Rolf, I am not trying to take a personal shot at you. I am sorry if that is how it sounded. What you do with your hard-earned money is your business.
I was merely trying to offer a counter-opinion that you don’t need 10M+ saved to retire comfortably. I understand that you and your wife are accustomed to a certain lifestyle, and the fact that you pay for your children to visit you is noble. My comments were to educate those younger rads who don’t know much about investing to not blindly throw their money into the hands of someone else. Many of the people I see who “can’t retire”, both in medicine and other professions, are in this situation by assuming too much risk with investments. Whether it was leveraging their homes, which were over-valued, or leaving too much assets in stock market, too much risk.
It’s a sad state right now, and these Banksters are the ones making a killing every year charging fees to try and rebuild the nest eggs they helped destroy in the first place.-
I funded my education fund for my children as has been advised above by many, eg Rolf/Kpack and others and thought it was very important. Though not with a trust as Rolf advises. As it turned out, I worried about it a bit much and perhaps did not need to and we (my wife and I) ended up paying the tuition ‘on the way’ quarter by quarter. All but one of the kids said thay regretted going away to more expensive schools and wished they had stayed home for the first 2 years at the local college, ie 4 and 2 year options were here. The middle child took a different route, and said college is not the right choice for him. NO MD, JD, Phd, MA, etc. ‘Would you fund the local trade school for 12 months and invest the rest for me for a yearly income?’
Done.
He makes about half the hourly wage of the professional school graduates locally, 80$ per hour for most of his days. and calls his own hours, works 3 days a week, with monthly income from his account also to fund his room and board and car. He manages his money now and the other grown kids are a bit reluctant to admit it, but they regret some of their choices, eg ‘prestigious’ undergrad schools. I now believe those types of colleges are not worth it, except for a few students, money wise and angst wise. A good solid undergrad college education can be had at several thousand different places now, including some degree pathways online, and you avoid the drunken and druggy lost weekends at the party schools too. Just my opinion, I know this flies in the face of the conventional wisdom on this board. I would just say, to those worried about fully funded $ for education for their 1-3 kids, chill.
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Telling someone to stop comparing Obama to Cyprus and to stop over speculating on Potential future Muni bond legislation is an…… Ad hominem attack
OK
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WTF does Cyprus have to do with Obama?
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Quote from MISTRAD
WTF does Cyprus have to do with Obama?
From the view of the far right:
Cyprus ran up high debt. It has a socialist leadership that is willing to show blatant disrepect for the rule of law.
Obama runs up high debt. Obama is a socialist who shows blatant disrespect for the rule of law.
Hence, what happens in Cyprus is bound, nay virtually guaranteed, to happen in the United States… unless of course Obama’s evil plan to destroy the nation can be stopped by true patiots.
Therefore, any person constructing a retirement portfolio should presume a large taking of their retirement assets by a future, equally socialist and evil, democratic administration.
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Anyway…. regarding retirement. It is not just about the absolute value of the current generation of older radiologists’ account, but about the connfidence that another crash isn’t coming. It will take a few years still until confidence that the great recession is truly over before rads start considering it truly safe to retire.
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I wonder if we’ll start to see reports of rads dying on the job.
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Quote from dergon
Anyway…. regarding retirement. It is not just about the absolute value of the current generation of older radiologists’ account, but about the connfidence that another crash isn’t coming. It will take a few years still until confidence that the great recession is truly over before rads start considering it truly safe to retire.
It mostly is the absolute value of your retirement account. Everyone knows that the closer you get to retirement, the less risk u should have. IE, virtually no money in the stock market. There are places to keep your money that offer guaranteed returns. Granted its only currently 0.5 – 1%. But at least when all of your friends are losing 20% of their value when the market corrects. You won’t. [:)]
I am surprised all of these wealth advisors that everyone use didn’t see the writing on the wall and instruct their clients to pull all their money out of the market before the correction in 2008.-
Even if you had a “5 years until retirement” general portfolio with a planned 30 years of retirement living, many people would have that at around 60% equities 40% bonds.
A person with that distribution still took a healthy beating in 2008.
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This is becoming too political, too simplistic and further away from the truth, IMO.
Quote from MISTRAD
WTF does Cyprus have to do with Obama?
From the view of the far right:
Cyprus ran up high debt. It has a socialist leadership that is willing to show blatant disrepect for the rule of law.
Obama runs up high debt. Obama is a socialist who shows blatant disrespect for the rule of law.Hence, what happens in Cyprus is bound, nay virtually guaranteed, to happen in the United States… unless of course Obama’s evil plan to destroy the nation can be stopped by true patiots.
Therefore, any person constructing a retirement portfolio should presume a large taking of their retirement assets by a future, equally socialist and evil, democratic administration.
___
Anyway…. regarding retirement. It is not just about the absolute value of the current generation of older radiologists’ account, but about the connfidence that another crash isn’t coming. It will take a few years still until confidence that the great recession is truly over before rads start considering it truly safe to retire.
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Look, I am a conservative. But Cyprus’s issues are so unique, to compare them to anyone is silly. Even comparing them to Greece is not fair.
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Back to the original post: I am 56 yo, just went part-time with my group, after having served as President for the past 12 years. (took the group from 8 to 26 Rads, started 4 outpatient Imaging Centers, went from One hospital to 4). Decided it was time to step-down, turn the practice over to a new ’empire builder’. Group asked me to stay on, but I felt this was be best decision for myself, and the group.
I saved for my children’s education through a combination of 529 and savings (I put $25,000) away in a fund for each child when they were about 3 (3 children). Each child went to a private college, in the Northwest USA. Savings were more than enough to pay their college costs. Paid off my mortgage as fast as I could, bought a Vacation home, and paid off that Mortgage as fast as I could. Saved a sizeable chunk of $ each month, placed in an S&P 500 index fund. Took the “Ups and Downs” of the market in stride, never touched this fund, other than to add to it. That said, I anticipate completely retiring in 4 years, living off about $250k year, w/o difficulty. The key to retirement is to save, pay off debt, and invest w/o meddling with your accounts. The USA is a safe bet, especially as Europe suffers. The world has to safeguard it’s money somewhere, so for the time being, the USA remains a great place to live, and invest.
Nrad-
That’s the way to do it. No debt
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Well done, Nrad.
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i see no issues with debt if the interest is low
student loans @3%? Sign me up. While currently deposits pay 1%, there is no way to tell what they will pay in 3 or 8 yrs. If there is inflation, it is very much to your benefit to have cash that can be “deposited @5%” than to have have paid off the loans that are currently @ 3%. It’s actually probably a draw at that point given you will pay taxes…however, if inflation goes to 8%…the #s change. What you give up by paying off a mortgage or loans is the opportunity cost of what that money can do for you. If your house, student, etc loands are @6 or 7%%, it’s almost a no brainer, especially for student. house 6% = 4% once you do the mortgage write off.
my overall point — these are no absolutes and whether they are very beneficial, smart etc depends on the circumstances, risk tolerance and so forth.-
Quote from wisdom
i see no issues with debt if the interest is low
student loans @3%? Sign me up. While currently deposits pay 1%, there is no way to tell what they will pay in 3 or 8 yrs. If there is inflation, it is very much to your benefit to have cash that can be “deposited @5%” than to have have paid off the loans that are currently @ 3%. It’s actually probably a draw at that point given you will pay taxes…however, if inflation goes to 8%…the #s change. What you give up by paying off a mortgage or loans is the opportunity cost of what that money can do for you. If your house, student, etc loands are @6 or 7%%, it’s almost a no brainer, especially for student. house 6% = 4% once you do the mortgage write off.
my overall point — these are no absolutes and whether they are very beneficial, smart etc depends on the circumstances, risk tolerance and so forth.
Agreed. It depends on where you are in life, etc.
But overall, the less debt the better. And these low interest rates are a historical outlier.
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Gold is no risk. It will be 3500 within 3 years.
I don’t know how you beat that investment.
And I’m a high risk guy.
The only thing that is a certainty in the world right now is that countries cannot stop the QE to infinity train. The sooner you realize that, the better you are to both predict, plan, and possibly offer up solutions.-
Gold is a HUGE risk.
If you had bought gold in the late 70s, you would have lost a huge amount of money until the last 5 years or so. For example, if you had bought gold at $600 an oz in 1980 (and that was not even the peak) your return until today, where the price is now $1600, would have been about 3% a year…not exactly stellar.
[link=http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-TV16sjzIo8E/T1uhzd9klWI/AAAAAAAAAS8/2E3Ez9c2hnk/s1600/gold-price-history.gif]http://2.bp.blogspot.com/…gold-price-history.gif[/link] -
Quote from Cigar
Gold is no risk. It [b]will[/b] be 3500 within 3 years.
Kids … be VERY wary of people that speak as if they know what the value of any asset will be in the future.
Gold is a hedge asset. If you hold it, you hold it as a hedge against he potential decline of a currency. Is it [i]possible[/i] that gold will be at 3500 in a few years? Sure it is. Is it possible that a global recovery takes hold and gold sits flat or decreases in value? Sure. I just don’t know, and neither does [b]Cigar[/b]. So stick with your portfolio plan for the long term. If holding some gold is part of it, then fine.-
‘Anybody notice the Cyprus tax on bank deposits as ordered by the EU chiefs? 6.5%—10% based on deposits.
Instituted over the weekend w/ a bank holiday today.
Run on banks now.
Govt strategy/EU strategy.’
NOTE to kpack and others…Obama not in this post. The follow up from others inserted the misleading Obama trail. Look at my follow up post, I did not intend a slam at Obama, but if the shoe fits…
Here is the nub of the issue: taxes can always hurt your savings.
We ignore that at our peril. Example 1/1/13, dividend tax went from 15% to 39.6 for most of us. Large array of other taxes went up in the ObamaCare legislation (there I said it!) and in the bipartisan tax act in Jan of this year, GOP and dems.
The muni bond tax floater may or not be real , but it is bandied about by the White House. That is fact.
The mortgage deduction repeal for high earners is put out there by both sides. Cmon guys, you are so sensitive!
You must admit tax planning MUST be part of planning.-
and to think I never knew Mistrad was a conservative!
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The point is the EU chiefs can tax when they want.
So can Congress and the President.
The motives of both are the same.
More $ for the EU or the US.
That is the common theme, and is basic human nature of
the political animal. Read your history.
Cut spending?
Nooooooo, oh , the horror!!!! -
Quote from MSK/SW
and to think I never knew Mistrad was a conservative!
LOL. I think I was probably the first openly conservative person here on this site. It is kind of like ‘coming out’.
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Regarding the cyprus “tax” on bank deposits, and how it relates to the USA. I could argue its ALREADY happened here
Apparently Cyprus banks have been paying depositors 5% interest on their money for the last several years. so after a 5-6% haircut, they are still ahead.
Here in the USA, our banks have been paying what? .00001% interest.
So who is better off?
One could argue that the Feds forced zero interest rate policy has ALREADY shortchanged the bank depositors by being a big bank, fat-cat “bail-in” -
I think you are wrong. You are a right of center. You have always seemed too have a logical reason for your positions and never seemed to be purely an idealogue unlike many here. I have sensed that you have left much of the off topic area as I have because it tends to be either far left or far right with areas of compromise.
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Great thread.
Very interesting discussions on group dynamics and expectations of younger Rads.
We all know this is market driven. Simple macroeconomics of supply and demand. Currently, established groups/rads have the stroke and control hiring practices.
In our practice younger Rads are poised to help acquire new business, but the more seasoned faction has the experience to make it happen and keep it hummimg.
I see the points on both sides of the fence on most things.
New starters need to make sure their group choice has real defined leadership and the stones to back it up come contract time.
Older Rads, need to welcome the new barnburners as the energy and excitement they bring is like lightning in a bottle. -
Quote from Raddocmed
I think you are wrong. You are a right of center. You have always seemed too have a logical reason for your positions and never seemed to be purely an idealogue unlike many here. I have sensed that you have left much of the off topic area as I have because it tends to be either far left or far right with areas of compromise.
It depends what you mean.
I am not a social conservative at all. I could give a flying you-know-what when it comes to social issues. I am very fiscally conservative however. I know some people have called me a libertarian…I wouldn’t go that far.
I think ideology gets us away from evidence based decisions. -
Quote from MISTRAD
Quote from Raddocmed
I think you are wrong. You are a right of center. You have always seemed too have a logical reason for your positions and never seemed to be purely an idealogue unlike many here. I have sensed that you have left much of the off topic area as I have because it tends to be either far left or far right with areas of compromise.
It depends what you mean.
I am not a social conservative at all. I could give a flying you-know-what when it comes to social issues. I am very fiscally conservative however. I know some people have called me a libertarian…I wouldn’t go that far.
I think ideology gets us away from evidence based decisions.
To try to tie this back to retirement —– I think that many people who are of the solid right have held a disproportionately negative view of the economy and the markets since the election and re-election of Mr. Obama. Glenn Beck hawking gold on TV (not coincidentally just after doing segments about how we’ll all be hoarding guns and clean water in our shelters), conspiracy theories about how Obama is going to seek a third term, the inappropriate comparisons of the US economy to Greece and Cyprus.
Take this gem from Beck:
[link=http://www.rightwingwatch.org/content/beck-start-hoarding-cash-now]http://www.rightwingwatch.org/content/beck-start-hoarding-cash-now[/link]After a lengthy opening monologue on last night’s program in which he declared that “[link=http://www.video.theblaze.com/media/video.jsp?content_id=25777831&topic_id=24584158]Emperor[/link]” Michael Bloomberg is the “[link=http://www.video.theblaze.com/media/video.jsp?content_id=25777965&topic_id=24584158]most dangerous man in America[/link],” Glenn Beck turned his attention to the [link=http://www.nytimes.com/2013/03/20/business/global/cyprus-set-to-reject-tax-on-bank-deposits.html?_r=0]financial crisis in Cyprus[/link] and [link=http://www.video.theblaze.com/media/video.jsp?content_id=25778067]urged his audience[/link] to pull their money out of the stock market and out of the banks and start stockpiling it at home since what is happening if Cyprus “will happen here” because “it has happened before; it happened the last time the progressives tried a utopia.”
Beck [link=http://youtu.be/BrpqznG2prI]went on to warn[/link] his audience not to tell anyone but their immediate family that they were hoarding money because “the last thing you want to be known as is someone with cash on hand when all of the banks are closed,” warning that they will “become more and more of a target” even from their “relatives who call you a joke now” because “drowning people pull others under the water”.
These things bounce around commonly and without challenge in the right media and have led many people who are exposed to that media, evidenced both here on AM and in my own RL circles, to make financial decisions that are not reflective of the world’s economic realities. Maybe they’re not hoarding cash, but I do know a personal friend who was convinced that the Obama win 11/12 meant a collapse of the market…. he sold into cash and since then has missed some 20% bump in the interval.
With a 20-30 year retirement horizon a person shouldn’t let something like the political party of the US presidency effect their overall strategy.
I don’t know Mistrad personally, but from his writings I would gather that he is a person able to divorce his politics from his financial decision making process. 🙂 -
Beck, first of all, is insane.
And that is precisely the point. Even with tax rates, which people mentioned above. If you are on a very long range plan (say 20 years or so) the only effect of those tax rates is on dividends. I am trying to move some of those into IRAs and the like. Other than selling a few stocks last year a little earlier than I would have otherwise, I didn’t let politics change any of my decisions.
I guess if they threatened 401k accounts or something (highly unlikely) then I may think twice.
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The dividend tax went from 15 to 20%
And I believe if you make less than 400,000 per year it stays at 15%
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Quote from kpack123
The dividend tax went from 15 to 20%
One of my rebalancing efforts for 2013 has been to become more conscious about *where* my dividend and income producing assets are held. I’ve tried to make sure that the bulk of dividend and income producing assets are held in my various tax-deferred accounts. I then keep the lower tax generating holdings and growth funds predominantly in my post-tax brokerage account.
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Either way you look at
A dividend tax/cap gain of 15% if you make less than 400K or 20% if you make over 400K is better than marginal rates
In my position at laest You can’t necessarily place everything into a retirement account
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Quote from kpack123
Either way you look at
A dividend tax/cap gain of 15% if you make less than 400K or 20% if you make over 400K is better than marginal rates
In my position at laest You can’t necessarily place everything into a retirement account
I have never believed taxes should be your primary determining factor…but shuffling stuff to take advantage of some lower rates makes sense.
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True but if you want to retire at 50 you need investments that you can get too as well
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Over leveraged govt?
3 options only…
1. austerity/tax increases/increased productivity/work
2. inflation and monetize the debt
3. renounce the debts. eg Argentina 1980s.
In US we have predominently done #2 with QE #1-3 by the Fed. with a little of #1 (sequester).
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Quote from Cigar
Gold is no risk. It will be 3500 within 3 years.
I don’t know how you beat that investment.
On the other side of the same coin….. a call for gold at $1375 by year end.
[link=http://www.businessinsider.com/socgen-gold-is-going-to-1375-2013-3]http://www.businessinsider.com/socgen-gold-is-going-to-1375-2013-3[/link]In a report published earlier this year, the analysts wrote that they expect gold prices to fall for four key reasons.[b] [/b]
Stronger U.S. dollar,Higher real interest rates, [b]Outflows from precious metal[/b] [b]Exchange traded products (ETP), Hedge funds are reducing their net long positions[/b]
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O RLY
lol any other brilliant investment advice? I’d like to do the opposite.
Quote from Cigar
Gold is no risk. It will be 3500 within 3 years.
I don’t know how you beat that investment.-
I don’t know how many times I’ve heard various experts and non-experts declare one thing and the opposite happens.
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The debt issue
Well, I agree there are definitely ways to manage debt in a positive way but
Debt as a tool is particularly effective if you can get low rates and channel that capital into a greater investment return. I’ve done that with rental properties in the past
Several of my properties still carry some debt but fortunately they cash flow and I’ve never had to use my own funds to pay a dime for them. I guess technically I have debt but my tenants are paying it off for me
My point is. If you are looking to retire early having little or no personal debt is probably the best way to do it because every Penney you pay in interest to someone else is a waste and a liability
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and to move it back to the topic at hand …..I hate debt.
I avoid it like the plague.
Sorry, but that is how I reached ‘$ critical mass’.
I do realize that others have more tolerance for it and can sleep well at night with lots of constructive debt. Not me.-
the mortgage house credit is economically a very dumb idea. sure, it’s great for those on here having huge mortgages but it’s inefficient economically and really not a good policy (albeit a profitable one for any high income earner) as it “wastes” a large amount of money which is geared much more toward the top. I think that most of us don’t need 8000 sq ft houses costing in excess of 500k. yet, having something like that allows you to write off a lot of taxes at the end of the year.
Austerity hasn’t worked so far anywhere in europe. Not sure it will here…Also not sure what the alternatives are
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[link=https://www.fidelity.com/viewpoints/personal-finance/nine-reasons-roth]https://www.fidelity.com/viewpoints/personal-finance/nine-reasons-roth[/link]
Considered this but did not bite. Would have to pay 39.6% on moved money. Roth IRA info.-
Again
The dividend tax stays the same at 15% for those making under 400K
Above 400K. It bumps to 20%.
Not the 39% you stated earlier
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Quote from MSK/SW
[link=https://www.fidelity.com/viewpoints/personal-finance/nine-reasons-roth]https://www.fidelity.com/viewpoints/personal-finance/nine-reasons-roth[/link]
Considered this but did not bite. Would have to pay 39.6% on moved money. Roth IRA info.
I thought it about it too. I made the calculation that at my age, with no children that I plan to pass the money to, the initial tax burden would have been greater that (or maybe a wash with) the future benefit.
And I didn’t want to give the notion that the only or even the primary goal of my portfolio is tax avoidance. I just am trying to maximize total return with appropriate risk. Taxes are just one of many considerations……. but taking advantage of the benefits offerred by tax deferred retirement vehicles seems a no brainer.-
BTW – the tax boys played the IRA thing brilliantly.
NO TAX! SO max out everything you can and invest it.
So when you take it out, they get 40% instead of 15%. They just have to wait a while.
Not that great deal.-
I think the roth conversion makes a lot of sense if you are younger — in early 30s. not that you can ever get all your assets in a roth, but having chunks of it helps. the more, the better at retirement time. so if you can somehow convert 200k or more…i think it’s worthwhile doing.
anyone have advice against it if you are you your 30s?
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Quote from dergon
Even if you had a “5 years until retirement” general portfolio with a planned 30 years of retirement living, many people would have that at around 60% equities 40% bonds.
A person with that distribution still took a healthy beating in 2008.
That type of thinking is why there are so many people in their late 50’s and early 60’s who can’t retire. Most experts recommend having closer to 15-20% equities that close to retirement.
@NRAD1, well done my friend. well done.
The bottom line is there is no quick way to make money. Saving as much as possible, keeping debt in check, and making smart investments are the key to success. High risk investments should be balanced with lower risk ones.-
[link=http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-505146_162-57562381/how-new-tax-rates-will-affect-you-in-2013/]http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-505146_162-57562381/how-new-tax-rates-will-affect-you-in-2013/[/link]
Kpack is right about the 20% dividend and interest tax, see above. Thank you for clarification, if I said otherwise, I must have misremembered!
Essentially, though, as in above, Medicare surtax of 3.8% on all investment income, including dividends, interest, muni bond interest, cap gains etc. applies in addition to the 20% if over 400 single /450 married, summing to 23.8%.
By the by, when did anyone offer Glenn Beck out as a paragon of financial advice on this board? I must have missed that.
Besides the obvious illogical stereotype (‘All conservatives are lousy financial advisors’) seems a bit of a loop to call in Mr. Beck to this discussion. Not sure how it applies except his comments on Cyprus, as quoted by the lefty tracking site, assuming its accuracy.
Many conservatives offer good advice, Milton Friedman, John Stuart Mill, Chicago School, Monetarists, Hayek, Vienna School, Larry Kudlow to name a few.
Of course some are good, some not good.
Just as with the lefties. Remember that paragon of financial advice for the Clinton and Obama administrations, the manager of the hedge fund, Jon (“I lost 3 $billion and don’t know where it is”) Corzine, former Dem. Gov. of NJ?
So, to get back to the post main subject, govt fiscal and monetary policy can harm savers and investors, and one must keep that in mind when planning ahead, as many agree on this board, but they point out it should not be the main factor above all, and I agree, unless you are considering the death tax, then better put it high up there, as #1 or lose about 40% of that over 5 mill $.-
My in entities is to work less
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Actually that is the old thinking. With life span much longer now most are recommending a much more agressive portfolio. Many actually argue 85/15 stocks to bonds. The going largely into bonds was when your life expectancy post retirement was less than 5 years. Not losing was what was needed then. Now you may live 20 years post retirement and need growth. As an example I did a quick retirement checker with agressive and conservative approachs. The conservative aprroach had less than 2/3rds the money available at 80 as the agressive did. The conservative didn’t make it to 85 but the agressive did.
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Might even live 30 yrs post retirement. Most scenarios use a Monte Carlo mathematical prediction, based on diversification, withdrawal rate, max savings at start point, and expenses.
Lots depends on your risk tolerance too, I think.
Can you sleep at night with the asset allocation you have?
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I like capital preservation. My hope is to make enough off of dividends to go on as long as I need it. Then divide the principle among the kids
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I love it when the US Conference of Mayors, big supporters of massive deficit spending and large social service entitlements, unfunded, and swollen earmarked transportation budgets, and huge rail projects with deficits as far as the eye can see, tell us that ‘somebody has to pay the bill’ !
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Quote from Cigar
Gold is no risk. It will be 3500 within 3 years.
I don’t know how you beat that investment.
[link=http://finance.yahoo.com/news/goldman-sachs-says-time-short-132705633.html]http://finance.yahoo.com/news/goldman-sachs-says-time-short-132705633.html[/link]
[b]Goldman Sachs Says It’s Time to Short Gold[/b]“Despite resurgence in [link=http://www.cnbc.com/id/100627520%28Read%20More:%20Gold%20Eases%20Before%20Fed%20Minutes%20%29]euro area risk aversion [/link]and disappointing [link=http://www.cnbc.com/id/100618938%28Read%20More:%20Gold%20Eases%20Before%20Fed%20Minutes%20%29]U.S. economic data [/link], gold prices are unchanged over the past month, highlighting how conviction in holding gold is quickly waning,” said Goldman Sachs analysts Damien Courvalin and Jeffrey Currie in the note.
The analysts cut their gold forecast to $1,450 per ounce for 2013 and $1,270 for 2014, the second cut in their price target this year.
“With our economists expecting few ramifications from Cyprus and that the recent U.S. slowdown will not derail the faster recovery they forecast in the second half of 2013, we believe a sharp rebound in gold prices is unlikely. Given gold’s recent lackluster price action and our economists’ expectation for higher U.S. real rates, we are lowering our U.S. dollar-denominated gold price forecast once again.”-
Short silver (ETF:ZSL) No reason that silver is as high as it is other than currency fluctuations.
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WSJ today…gotta love those democrats, they never give up.
[link=http://www.auntminnie.com/article/SB10001424127887324010704578416882575799330.html?mod=WSJ_hpp_LEFTTopStories]Will the Government Shrink Your IRA? [/link][/h2] [b]Family Value:[/b] President Obama’s new budget seeks to limit contributions to retirement accounts when their assets reach $3.4 million. Here’s what you need to know.-
Dead link – Got another?
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Here
[link=http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424127887324010704578416882575799330.html?mod=WSJ_hpp_MIDDLENexttoWhatsNewsForth]http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424127887324010704578416882575799330.html?mod=WSJ_hpp_MIDDLENexttoWhatsNewsForth[/link]
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Nope, the current generation of old rads will have to be peeled off of the PACS stations.
Who wouldn’t want to coast for 500-750k while the young partners work themselves to death and the majority of the work is done by seriously underpaid “employee” positions.-
Quote from BruceCampbell
Nope, the current generation of old rads will have to be peeled off of the PACS stations.
Who wouldn’t want to coast for 500-750k while the young partners work themselves to death and the majority of the work is done by seriously underpaid “employee” positions.
Several groups I know have hired recently at 180k to 190k for junior partners, with 3 years or more to partnership. Working at 180k still beats doing a 3rd fellowship, so there have been many takers. The other alternative is to work for Imaging Advantage and Radisphere. Quantum and US telerad recently posted a job with 14 days on, 7 days off, which would been unheard of a year ago. Vrad recently cut rad salaries by 20 to 30 percent.
Ironically, these jobs at 180k are actually decent jobs, with same hours and calls as senior partners. Other jobs that I know of start at 300k or 350k, but they double or triple your work load, A LOT more calls and nights and weekends compared to senior partners. So you end up worse in the end.
But if you complain, you might be a troll here or Chopra or UGA. And then you have people on here like Raddocmed, who claimed that he worked as a pediatrician 20 years ago, and now as a rad makes a lot more money, with 26 weeks off a year, coming in at 9:30am and leaving at 3:30pm. Raise your hand if any of you found this kind of job anywhere in the last 5 years?
My advice for recent fellows: try to moonlight for a week at the job that you just signed, to get the real scoop. Trust me when I say that your senior partners are always nice on the day of the interview. It is the day to day work after the interview that matters MORE. And don’t get too attached to the salary. A 300k job sounds really good on paper compared to a 180k job. But you are going to be there really early, leave really late, take a lot more night and weekend calls. In the mean time, your senior partners are at home playing with their kids and making a lot more money than you.
Many fellows jumping for the higher paying jobs end up leaving these jobs after a year because of burnt-out. So a 180k a year job might be better after all.
When you talk to other junior partners that left, ask if there is a gag clause. Some are not allowed to bad-mouth their previous employers, so they are not helpful in telling you the truth about the practice.-
May as well just be an employee for a large corp on the clock, same low pay, dont have kill yourself, and prob more job security. By the time these juniors become partners, their group may very well cease to exist.
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FP salaries now over 200k, will be interesting to see who does 7 post grad years versus 3 over the next year?
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Quote from radiologistradiologist
Quote from BruceCampbell
Nope, the current generation of old rads will have to be peeled off of the PACS stations.
Who wouldn’t want to coast for 500-750k while the young partners work themselves to death and the majority of the work is done by seriously underpaid “employee” positions.
Several groups I know have hired recently at 180k to 190k for junior partners, with 3 years or more to partnership. Working at 180k still beats doing a 3rd fellowship, so there have been many takers. The other alternative is to work for Imaging Advantage and Radisphere. Quantum and US telerad recently posted a job with 14 days on, 7 days off, which would been unheard of a year ago. Vrad recently cut rad salaries by 20 to 30 percent.
Ironically, these jobs at 180k are actually decent jobs, with same hours and calls as senior partners. Other jobs that I know of start at 300k or 350k, but they double or triple your work load, A LOT more calls and nights and weekends compared to senior partners. So you end up worse in the end.But if you complain, you might be a troll here or Chopra or UGA. And then you have people on here like Raddocmed, who claimed that he worked as a pediatrician 20 years ago, and now as a rad makes a lot more money, with 26 weeks off a year, coming in at 9:30am and leaving at 3:30pm. Raise your hand if any of you found this kind of job anywhere in the last 5 years?
My advice for recent fellows: try to moonlight for a week at the job that you just signed, to get the real scoop. Trust me when I say that your senior partners are always nice on the day of the interview. It is the day to day work after the interview that matters MORE. And don’t get too attached to the salary. A 300k job sounds really good on paper compared to a 180k job. But you are going to be there really early, leave really late, take a lot more night and weekend calls. In the mean time, your senior partners are at home playing with their kids and making a lot more money than you.
Many fellows jumping for the higher paying jobs end up leaving these jobs after a year because of burnt-out. So a 180k a year job might be better after all.
When you talk to other junior partners that left, ask if there is a gag clause. Some are not allowed to bad-mouth their previous employers, so they are not helpful in telling you the truth about the practice.
Not only do I think this makes sense but I also think you are right and it justifies my position for some time now, the extra pay when you’re already making 20 stacks of high society isn’t worth it. Throw in a dash of higher taxes = less incentive and it cinches it. Good stuff.
The next 2-3 years with the new test and all the health care changes should be interesting …
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Quote from IGotKids2Feed
May as well just be an employee for a large corp on the clock, same low pay, dont have kill yourself, and prob more job security. By the time these juniors become partners, their group may very well cease to exist.
When the group falls apart at least you won’t be holding any buy-in and can just… walk away.
While I agree that working not hard at all for not a lot of money is preferable to working very hard for a little more money, it still would be nice to work hard for a lot of money. But that’s getting harder and harder to find.
The worst tracks are the employee positions they “promise” a partnership without any definite track to get more than the usual 9-5 and walk away labor from them.-
I was walking through the hospital the other day and as I’m climbing some stairs a man in his 70s sees a sign that say “Dr. Appreciation Day” and says to a volunteer sitting right by the sign, “What, we don’t pay them enough money.”? The [not surprising] ignorance made me chuckle, though of course if referring to his generation, he is right. Nevertheless, it astounds me that a guy who [b]also[/b] was in a generation that [i]had all the opportunity in the world[/i] and most of whom retired on the most ridiculous pensions the world has ever seen, would say that. Just goes to show you what we’re up against. Such people didn’t live every day under the possibility of a lawsuit that may or may not ruin your confidence and/or career. Why don’t people think twice about what they say? Jealousy? There is a basic principle that people aren’t aware of, and that is … “the more risk you take on the greater your reward” — it’s a universal.
You’d think years of a 9-5 without getting sued and drawing on a system 3x what you paid in would make you GRATEFUL, not envious.-
Dr appreciation day is a sign of how far we’ve fallen. We doctors should be in charge, hosting apprec days for others. Now we’re just little workers for administrators in charge.
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Quote from Cigar
I was walking through the hospital the other day and as I’m climbing some stairs a man in his 70s sees a sign that say “Dr. Appreciation Day” and says to a volunteer sitting right by the sign, “What, we don’t pay them enough money.”? The [not surprising] ignorance made me chuckle, though of course if referring to his generation, he is right. Nevertheless, it astounds me that a guy who [b]also[/b] was in a generation that [i]had all the opportunity in the world[/i] and most of whom retired on the most ridiculous pensions the world has ever seen, would say that. Just goes to show you what we’re up against. Such people didn’t live every day under the possibility of a lawsuit that may or may not ruin your confidence and/or career. Why don’t people think twice about what they say? Jealousy? There is a basic principle that people aren’t aware of, and that is … “the more risk you take on the greater your reward” — it’s a universal.
You’d think years of a 9-5 without getting sued and drawing on a system 3x what you paid in would make you GRATEFUL, not envious.
If you have a chance, talk to Edward Sickles, former chief of mamo at UCSF, and read the malpractice book by Leonard Berlin, published through ARRS. Both Sickles and Berlin testified for the plaintiff as expert witnesses. Unlike surgery or ER or IM, your mistake as a radiologist now on PACS is for the whole world to see, to be magnified and zoom, and window leveled to stand out in the court room. In the old days, films literally would go missing when there is a lawsuit. There was no evidence. Now you have PACs. If a doctor missed the heart murmur or conjunctival petechiae and the patient died of septic emboli, he would say that these signs were not there when he examined the patient. The risks for radiologists are huge in comparison. And a lawsuit sticks with you for the rest of your life. If you haven’t been sued yet, that is because you are lucky, not because you are good. Don’t get too arrogant. Get a chance to talk to Sickles and Berlin, they will bring you down to earth.
Therefore, as a radiologist, I have no shame in saying that for the risks I take everyday, I am UNDER paid, and OVER worked. My partners and I deserve more money. I have been telling this to the CEOs and MBAs at our hospitals every chance I got, especially when it came to contract negotiation. You would be surprised how other specialties and management UNDERestimate the importance of our field.
On another note, contribute to RADPACS when you can. And for residents in training, ACR has programs to go visit the Capital and talk to Senators and Representatives. Take up on these opportunities, radiology is not about reading films in the dark, isolated from politics and business.-
Quote from radiologistradiologist
If you have a chance, talk to Edward Sickles, former chief of mamo at UCSF, and read the malpractice book by Leonard Berlin, published through ARRS. Both Sickles and Berlin testified for the plaintiff as expert witnesses. Unlike surgery or ER or IM, your mistake as a radiologist now on PACS is for the whole world to see, to be magnified and zoom, and window leveled to stand out in the court room. In the old days, films literally would go missing when there is a lawsuit. There was no evidence. Now you have PACs. If a doctor missed the heart murmur or conjunctival petechiae and the patient died of septic emboli, he would say that these signs were not there when he examined the patient. The risks for radiologists are huge in comparison. And a lawsuit sticks with you for the rest of your life. If you haven’t been sued yet, that is because you are lucky, not because you are good. Don’t get too arrogant. Get a chance to talk to Sickles and Berlin, they will bring you down to earth.
Therefore, as a radiologist, I have no shame in saying that for the risks I take everyday, I am UNDER paid, and OVER worked. My partners and I deserve more money. I have been telling this to the CEOs and MBAs at our hospitals every chance I got, especially when it came to contract negotiation. You would be surprised how other specialties and management UNDERestimate the importance of our field.
On another note, contribute to RADPACS when you can. And for residents in training, ACR has programs to go visit the Capital and talk to Senators and Representatives. Take up on these opportunities, radiology is not about reading films in the dark, isolated from politics and business.
I completely agree. I feel the problems facing our field, were partly our own fault, and by own, i am referring to those rads in practice over the last 20 years. As a resident, I saw how the dept chair instructed us all never to “block” a study, unless it was truly dangerous to pt, ie radiating pregnant, overscan peds, etc. In practice, these situations come up fairly infrequently.
I did not realize it at the time, but the trend over the last 10 years was to increase imaging volume as reimbursement started dropping. This is a natural response to maintain revenue. The problem is, the politicans see this as “over-utilization”, and just gives them more incentive to pass further cuts. So now, instead of trying to limit the number of imaging studies, in order to maintain appropriate reimbursement, we are trying to improve “efficiency” so we can all do and read more cases for less pay.
I think most rads were too concerned with making their “fortunes” during the “golden years”, rather then getting politically involved to try and slow this runaway train of reimbursement cuts. Not sure we can slow it now, as the horse has already left the barn. The only hope for the younger guys in their 30’s and 40’s is to wait till the “fat-cats” retire or burn-out and then try and restructure the groups to be more “fair”. I know several groups in NorthEast, where the salary differences between highest and lowest paid rads could be 2xfold, or up to 3xfold. These are all full-time rads with similar call responsibilities.-
Rads were not source of over utilisation. It was and will remain self referrers. As rads it’s almost impossible to stand in the way of the train of clinicians ordering imaging because their clinical diagnostic skills have gone to pot. This rush to blame rads a generation removed from you doesn’t help anyone. The older rads have generally tried to hold onto turf so you can have a decent career. At least acknowledge that.
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The so called gate keeper of refusing studies puts at direct odds with hospitals and administrations too
I can’t tell you how many worthless meetings I sat in ith administration who with one hat was complaining to us about tech call ins for unnecessary exams and then with the other hat going to their ER meetings and putting no think pathways in place that basically force ER docs or ER physicians assistants to order exams based on Chief complaints
Basically a patient comes in for headache. ER doc is forced by administration not to think……… Just get a CT.
Then radiologist gets beatched at for doing the study
If we don’t do the study we disrupt protocol and are viewed as obstructionists
This merry go around is more administration driven if you ask me …… And the hospital administration just sits back counts the revenue and look who they can divert blame on
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It’s a tough situation. Declining a scan is a conflict of interest when the rad group is fee for service. When faced with the dubious CT request – I try to “do no harm”. Our threshold for accepting a dubious pediatric CT referral is much higher than for a senior citizen.
If there are no “negative” CT scans – we are probably missing a lot that should have been done.-
Quote from adopted canuck
If there are no “negative” CT scans – we are probably missing a lot that should have been done.
In what universe are you living? (just kidding – I know you’re in eastern Canada[:)])
The problem is exactly the opposite – too few positives. I wonder what people on this forum think would be an acceptable true positive rate for ER head CTs. In my practice, the true positive rate is extremely low (<1%). In a major urban trauma center I’m sure it’s higher, but is probably still < 5%. And by positive, I mean a scan that yields clinically actionable information, not just a bump on the scalp.
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A study does not have to be positive to be useful. Do you hear pathologists complaining about low positive rates for routine lab values or no malignancy results for skin biopsies or Pap smears?
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Quote from IGotKids2Feed
A study does not have to be positive to be useful. Do you hear pathologists complaining about low positive rates for routine lab values or no malignancy results for skin biopsies or Pap smears?
Nobody is suggesting a negative exam is completely unhelpful. But it is not as though performing CTs is without any downside, whether it be radiation risk or increasing the cost of medical care. More judicious use by the ER would be a welcome change, but obviously that’s never going to happen until the incentives for ordering imaging tests are altered (i.e. ACOs and medmal reform).
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Hi Elegiac – less than 1% sounds very low. We have had a couple of bleeds and a maxillary trauma out of 9 on call heads since Friday evening. Two were “probably inappropriate negatives” but older patients who leave the hospital feeling reassured by a scan. We only average a couple of cases on a weekday evening and 15 – 20 over the weekend. (I have just jinxed tonight though)
The problem for us is the occasional “rent a doc” in the ER. The unknown locum who generates a load of dubious referrals in rapid succession. After half a dozen BS cases – the threshold goes up and the one patient that actually needs a scan meets resistance. It’s a no win situation.
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Quote from rayZor
Rads were not source of over utilisation. It was and will remain self referrers. As rads it’s almost impossible to stand in the way of the train of clinicians ordering imaging because their clinical diagnostic skills have gone to pot. This rush to blame rads a generation removed from you doesn’t help anyone. The older rads have generally tried to hold onto turf so you can have a decent career. At least acknowledge that.
You are completely right.
I would like to personally thank every radiologist in practice, with more then 15 years experience post training, for all their hard work at fighting reimbursement cuts and closing loop holes in Stark Law.
The younger generation truly appreciates all the personal effort you made on Capitol Hill and the millions of personal income you spent in lobbying to fight these cuts. I feel blessed to be in the company of such nobility.
#Sarcasm-
sarcasm duly noted. but radiology didn’t grow to be a desirable specialty by default.
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Quote from rayZor
sarcasm duly noted. but radiology didn’t grow to be a desirable specialty by default.
Radiology grew into a desirable specialty because we have become the hands, eyes and stethoscope for the non-rads.
Your back hurts? Here’s a script for MRI.
Your knee hurts? Here’s a script for MRI.
You have belly pain? We can do a CT.
The list is endless, a true clinician can do our job much quicker and cheaper, by taking detailed H&P. But those take time, and insurance does not pay more for detailed H&P, so they dump work onto someone else, so they can bill for another encounter.-
I haven’t seen a true clinician in a long time
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burton rad – curious as to the capital structure of your group. Seeing income discrepancies of 3 fold in the same city is common. An academic or VA job would typically pay a fifth of what a fully vested partner would make in PP in the same city. No change there.
The drop in standard of living for younger rads compared to older boomers is in line with many professions and trades. Where are all the 80 – 90 K manufacturing jobs in Ohio, Penn and Michigan? The ones that had great health insurance that boomers could get out of high school and retire with a pension and health care 40 years later.
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[b]closing loop holes in Stark Law[/b]
I was told before that Stark laws were anti-capitalism.
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Quote from IGotKids2Feed
A study does not have to be positive to be useful. Do you hear pathologists complaining about low positive rates for routine lab values or no malignancy results for skin biopsies or Pap smears?
4+
The marginal benefit of medical system and healthcare is very small. For example, out of 10 office visits, at most one may change prognosis. Or out of 10 consults, barely one or two really change patient’s management.
Reassurance is sometimes one of the greatest yields of a test. For example, a patient with cancer who has headache. A negative brain MRI can be very useful. -
Huh? the ratio between VA and PP is variable, as the VA pay scale is based on cost of living — the VA in San Diego and Chicago pays way more than the VA in a smaller town with lower cost of living.
In some cities, VA salaries are nearly 1:1 with typical (not the top 1% PP) And…there is absolutely no doubt that at the VA you get at least double the pay /study given how much easier the work is and how much lower the volumes are….
manufacturing jobs paying 80k exist. have you heard of windfarm technicians? in the auto industry too, but making >100k was always a matter of overtime and how much overtime.
Lastly, we are not mechanics or people with 14 wks of vocational training. as such, i don’t want to see us compare ourselves to industries that have 1/50th the training.-
Could you specify the VAs that pay 1:1 relative to typical local PP?
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i think the one in san diego might qualify. i am not well traveled enough to know all salaries in all markets, however, there certainly are groups where the pay is 30% less than your “average” salary. all depends on how many insured, uninsured, and poorly ensured patients you have and how many of them hit your ER after hours.
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Of course it is wisdom! The ratio varies from market to market and over time. In 2005 urban pacific northwest top PP group’s vested partners were pulling in 800K, second from top around 720K. Associate professor local teaching hospital 200 – 220K Local VA 170K. Benefits were reasonable though.
Maybe the ratio has narrowed in recent years – but 1:1 really??
The diminished standard of living is generational and effects a very wide socioeconomic spectrum.
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The VA 1:1 with PP? Not even in the current job market or on a per-study basis.
The reason the VA uses so many locums and does so many fee-basis consults is because of typical government stupidity: they won’t pay a reasonable salary to get people to work there vs PP, but they DO pay higher than market PP rates for a patient to go to a private facility and get seen by a PP doc. They are also allowed to pay locums docs more than their employed docs.
In other words, they save money with one hand by offering crappy employee salaries (and no prospect of partnership, obviously), and then turn around and waste it with the other hand on expensive fee-basis and locums docs. And the fee-basis docs know they can charge the VA extortionate rates, and so they do.
The logical thing to do would be to increase VA specialists’ salaries so that they can attract enough specialists as employed physicians, and avoid doing so many fee-basis consults and having to hire so many locums, but the government just isn’t that smart.
This applies to specialists, of course. They are generally able to find primary care docs at the normal VA salary.-
You make it anywhere near competitive and I’m there in a flash. Heck, I might be there anyway. But you gotta come 2+ or it would be sorta silly at this point
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Quote from Cigar
You make it anywhere near competitive and I’m there in a flash. Heck, I might be there anyway. But you gotta come 2+ or it would be sorta silly at this point
sign me up too – fascinating cases and great respect for the finest patients.
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A friend from med school works at maguire VA in Richmond, VA. Pay is nearly 1:1 to private practice assuming non-partner. VA gets rad residents too.
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On July 1 my group had it’s first “normal” retirement in 5 years or so. Yeah, people had left, been pushed subtly (or not so subtly) out the door, but this one was good old fashioned retirement. Mid 60s, kids out of the house…. time to enjoy summers on Cape Cod.
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Quote from dergon
On July 1 my group had it’s first “normal” retirement in 5 years or so. Yeah, people had left, been pushed subtly (or not so subtly) out the door, but this one was good old fashioned retirement. Mid 60s, kids out of the house…. time to enjoy summers on Cape Cod.
Good for them, I am sure he/she is happy to be out of the game…out of curiosity is your group now looking to hire?
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We’re actually a bit fat, having hired a half dozen or so since the beginning of last year. Depending on how some new potential contracts shake out we might need more 2014 …. but that’s a “keep your finger crossed and hope” kind of thing.
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Are offers averaging 180k now the norm out of fellowship?
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Quote from kevinddurrr
Are offers averaging 180k now the norm out of fellowship?
I personally do not know any recently graduated fellow starting anywhere near that low.-
180 is around what I was offered but I didn’t get the job. There were lots of applicants.
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again, it is not advisable to discuss pay on a public forum. It can only hurt us. Journalists, politicians, and others who are not our friends are reading this forum. That is what PM is for.
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Desirable Midwest. We are not offering “much higher”
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Quote from Dr.Sardonicus
again, it is not advisable to discuss pay on a public forum. It can only hurt us. Journalists, politicians, and others who are not our friends are reading this forum. That is what PM is for.
Agreed. We aren’t helping anyone by making this public. Numbers should be sent through PM.
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[link=http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-10-14/fama-s-nobel-work-shows-active-managers-fated-to-lose.html]http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-10-14/fama-s-nobel-work-shows-active-managers-fated-to-lose.html[/link]
A bit of Nobel economics in the news, arguing in favor of passive investment 🙂
[h1]Famas Nobel Work Shows Active Managers Fated to Lose[/h1]His conclusion that investors would be better off in low-cost funds that track the markets performance helps explain the success of Vanguard Group Inc., the biggest U.S. mutual-fund company, as well as the rise of passive investments, which had more than $2.6 trillion in U.S. assets between exchange-traded funds and mutual funds at the end of 2012.
Dergon is still plugging away with monthly dca investing in low cost indexes. He crosses his fingers and hopes for a few more good years in the market.
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Quote from MISTRAD
Quote from Dr.Sardonicus
again, it is not advisable to discuss pay on a public forum. It can only hurt us. Journalists, politicians, and others who are not our friends are reading this forum. That is what PM is for.
Agreed. We aren’t helping anyone by making this public. Numbers should be sent through PM.
Totally agree * directed at above post *-
Not to stir the pot but an FP starts higher than 220, nice job by the academics glutting this field.
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Not to stir the pot but an FP starts higher than 220, nice job by the academics glutting this field.
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AGAIN
specific salary numbers can harm radiologists, regardless of their accuracy
Please refrain from posting.-
Thats very true-stupid to post amts
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Quote from Rolf Rad
AGAIN
specific salary numbers can harm radiologists, regardless of their accuracyPlease refrain from posting.
I am a US medical student interested in radiology trying to determine what sort of salary one can expect. What resources do you guys recommend to look into these sorts of numbers? I’m not quite comfortable asking my radiology mentors these sorts of questions.
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Salary should not matter. All physicians make a livable wage. You must be certain that you can tolerate radiology for the next 30 years. Any salary quotes will likely be lower when you are out. The averages out there for our field include inflated partner salaries which most grads these days will likely not come near.
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I heard that avg starting salary for a post fellowship rad is around 220. That sounds correct given the declining reimbursements and partner income. Furthermore, a fellow can only be 70% as efficient as a seasoned rad (even some good ones).
