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Are Evangelicals relevant?
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Charlie Shamp a self-proclaimed Christian prophet who backed Donald Trump in 2020 told the Jim Bakker Show last week that God isnt backing Trump in the 2024 election this time, Rolling Stone reports.
Said Shamp: We need to watch Ron DeSantis. Because the Lord is going to use him in a powerful way.
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Listening to Brian Lehrer on WNYC this morning. Part of the program was anti-LGBTQ laws in Uganda and worldwide. Apparently Evangelicals are behind the push to outlaw LGBTQ people including up to the death penalty.
It’s what Jesus would want.
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[link=https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2023/04/03/how-christian-is-christian-nationalism]Kalefa Sanneh
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[h1][b]How Christian Is Christian Nationalism?[/b][/h1] [b]Many Americans who advocate it have little interest in religion and an aversion to American culture as it currently exists. What really defines the movement?[/b]
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By the time Trump reluctantly left office, in 2021, his relationship with evangelical Christians was one of the most powerful alliances in American politics. (According to one survey, he won eighty-four per cent of the white evangelical vote in 2020.) On January 6th, when his supporters gathered in Washington to protest the election results, one person brought along a placard depicting Jesus wearing a [i]maga[/i] hat; during the Capitol invasion, a shirtless protester delivered a prayer on the Senate floor. Thank you for filling this chamber with patriots that love you, and that love Christ, he said.
The events of January 6th bolstered a growing belief that the alliance between Trump and his Christian supporters had become something more like a movement, a pro-Trump uprising with a distinctive ideology. This ideology is sometimes called Christian nationalism, a description that often functions as a diagnosis. On a recent episode of [i]rev[/i]covery, a podcast about leaving Christian ministry, Justin Gentry, one of the hosts, suggested that the belief system was somewhat obscure even to its own adherents. I think that, spitballing, seventy per cent of Christian nationalists dont know that theyre Christian nationalists, he said. Theyre just, like, This is normal Christianity, from the time of Jesus.
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The strangest thing about the debate over Christian nationalism is the assumption shared by many of the participants. The sociologists see a fearful tribe, resentful of a country that wont stop changing. Exponents see a small but indomitable movement, standing strong against a tide of secularism. Miller sees an opportunity for Christians to play a constructive role in a changing country, preaching what their compatriots may no longer practice. But the underlying idea is that recent trends will continue: that churches will keep emptying out, and that Christianity will become an ever more tribal identity. The secular country that emerges might be increasingly free, anxious, and unpredictableless prayer in schools, more shamans in the Capitol. Why should we assume, though, that these trends are irreversible, and that most of todays Americans are beyond the reach of a message that has reached so many for so long? Earlier periods of secularization in America have given way to periods of Christian renewal. Is the next Christian revival just around the corner? It seems hard to believebut, surely, not impossible.
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Conservative Christians have s a right to choose to live in a majority community … just like native Americans choose to live on reservations.[image]https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/images/smilies/rolleyes.gif[/image]
[link=https://twitter.com/ohshidt/status/1646519502283362307]https://twitter.com/ohshi…us/1646519502283362307[/link]
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A mind is a terrible thing to waste.
Lotsa wasted minds with conservatives. Helps to be ignorant of history.
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Hobby poster says what?
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[link=https://www.politico.com/news/2023/04/21/trump-values-voter-wing-gop-00093175]Politico[/link]:
[h2]Trump killed the values voter wing of the GOP. It isnt coming back in 2024.[/h2] On the eve of a Christian cattle call in Iowa, the two 2024 contenders who talk the most about their faith arent gaining traction.
Unlike in Republican presidential primaries past, just two candidates Pence, the former Catholic turned evangelical, and Scott, who speaks of finding a God Solution to the countrys racial divide stand alone in making explicit appeals to Evangelical voters. Trump and DeSantis, meanwhile, are relying solely on their reputations as brute-force brawlers in the culture wars.
Their success and the difficulties Pence and Scott are having courting voters, according to recent polls reflects a major change in the evangelical bloc of the GOP electorate in the Trump era. When five GOP presidential candidates take the stage at Iowas Faith & Freedom Coalition in Clive on Saturday, vowing to take on the woke left will likely mean more than reciting the Apostles Creed.
Evangelicals have changed and have become more populist and more renegade and wanting to fight more and engage in Christian culture, said David Brody, the chief political analyst for Christian Broadcasting Network, who wrote the The Faith of Donald J. Trump. Trump has a following who wants to fight because they see culture going to hell in a handbasket, and thats whats winning the day in politics. And thats why he is winning with them.
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[h3][link=https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2023/05/trump-supporters-republican-approval-cnn-town-hall/674142/]Four Forces Bind Trump’s Supporters More Tightly Than Ever[/link][/h3]
First, Trump supporters deny the worst things he has done.
Second, Trump supporters catastrophize the threats of the left.
Third, Trump and his supporters are frantically trying to portray President Joe Biden as more corrupt than his predecessor.
A fourth justification that supporters of Donald Trump have constructed is that his presidency was an unqualified success, that Trump did practically everything right. [/QUOTE]Which brings me back to supporters of Donald Trump. Its a challenge for many of them, especially those who identify as people of faith, to reconcile what they claim to valueintegrity, honor, truthfulness, decency, compassionwith the fact that they support a misogynist who has cheated on his wives and sexually abused women; threatened judges, prosecutors, and election officials; used hundreds of millions of dollars in military assistance to pressure a foreign leader to dig up dirt on his political opponent; catalyzed a violent insurrection and engaged in a multipart conspiracy to overturn the lawful results of the 2020 presidential election; dined with white-supremacist and anti-Semites; cheated on his taxes; lied pathologically; routinely used cruel and dehumanizing rhetoric; and promoted political violence.
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The psychological phenomenon Ive described in this essay isnt exclusive to members of one party or to politics. We all live in ways that are at odds with our deepest beliefs. We all rationalize our shortcomings; we all engage in forms of denial. Each of us has blind spots, seeing confirmation bias in others but not in ourselves. But there are varying degrees of self-deception, different lengths to which we go to justify our decisions. What is so striking is just how much Trump demanded of his supporters. He has gone to the darkest places, and they have followed him every step of the way.
If most Republicans finally do break with Trumpand at this point, [link=https://archive.ph/o/5YulB/[link=https://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2024/president/us/2024_republican_presidential_nomination-7548.html]https://www.realclearpoli…l_nomination-7548.html[/link]]very little evidence[/link] suggests they willit wont be because of any road-to-Damascus revelation. It will be done respectfully, even reverentially, not because they have rejected his style of politics, but because they sense that his time has come and gone. And if Trump is dethroned as the leader of the Republican Party, whoever succeeds him will have modeled themselves after him. Trumpism will outlive Trump. Its the cost of the lies we sometimes tell ourselves.
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Its clear who believes the purpose of this forum is to prove their side is better than the other.
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Pat Robertson goes to that warm fundraising religious place..
Bye bye
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xxxdupxxx
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[link=https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/donald-trump/faith-trump-dominates-annual-gathering-religious-conservatives-rcna90931]NBC News[/link]:
[h1]Faith in Trump dominates annual gathering of religious conservatives[/h1] Nothing elicited cheers from the crowd like mentions of the former president.
Trump took the stage to a huge ovation and chants of “USA, USA, USA.”
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Throughout the three-day event, nearly a dozen Republican presidential candidates were among the more than 50 speakers, but none could compete with even the mere mentions of Trumps name, which each time elicited vocal reaction from the crowd.
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The mood at the event is yet another example underscoring that Trump is the current leader of the Republican Party, and any talks of so-called Trump fatigue amid an endless stream of investigations and legal problems, including two indictments, have not eroded his support with the GOP faithful.
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[link=https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2023/07/14/tucker-carlson-puts-mike-pence-his-place-todays-gop/?utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter&utm_campaign=wp_main]https://www.washingtonpos…p;utm_campaign=wp_main[/link]
Tucker Carlson puts Mike Pence in his place in todays GOP[/h1]
[b]Rarely has the Trump-era overhaul of the GOP been put in such stark relief as it was on Friday. This evangelical forum was not Pences audience, it was Carlsons in line with the outspoken base of the party as much as a religious movement.[/b]What was more remarkable was just how much the audience was on Carlsons side. U.S. support for Ukraine [link=https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2023/07/10/gop-ukraine-support/?itid=lk_inline_manual_9]divides the GOP about evenly[/link], but if you watched the interview youd think this was a settled matter in the party. There was no quarter for pro-Ukraine sentiments.
Carlson pressed Pence on the idea that the United States shouldnt spend money to help Ukraine given it has too many domestic concerns. The audience loudly applauded Carlson but not Pences arguments that Ukraine should also be a priority. That included when Pence pushed back by telling Carlson, Ive heard that routine from you before.
…The most telling example of where Pence stands in todays GOP may have come when he offered what aides must have thought was a bona fide applause line.
A year and a half ago, Russia had the second most powerful military in the world, {Pence} said. Today, they have the second most powerful military in Ukraine.
The line was met with virtual silence, apparently to Pences surprise. All that was missing was a [link=https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-fix/wp/2016/11/05/watch-2016s-top-unscripted-moments/?itid=lk_inline_manual_18]Please clap[/link].[/QUOTE]
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[link=https://www.mediaite.com/politics/key-iowa-evangelical-bob-vander-plaats-hosts-desantis-at-church-and-buries-trump-on-social-media/]Key Iowa Evangelical Bob Vander Plaats Hosts DeSantis at Church and Buries Trump on Social Media
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Influential Iowa evangelical [b]Bob Vander Plaats[/b] was joined by Florida Gov. [b]Ron DeSantis[/b] at Soteria Des Moines church Sunday, a day after slamming the governors 2024 opponent [b]Donald Trump[/b] on social media.
On Saturday, Vander Platts retweeted Iowa talk radio host [b]Steve Deace[/b] tearing into Trump as having handed the country and his balls to Fauci-Birx and being responsible for the very ballot-harvesting the ex-president claims cost him the election.
This, and more, is why @realDonaldTrump supporters are looking for another candidate, Vander Platts wrote in the quote retweet. The facts arent lining up with the repetitive rhetoric. This is the #swamp.[/QUOTE]
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None of that matters. RD wont beat DJT in a primary. Will,any of those voters choose Biden because they are told Trump is evil? Of course not. All we can hope for is they stay away from the polls.
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[link=https://www.npr.org/2023/08/08/1192663920/southern-baptist-convention-donald-trump-christianity]https://www.npr.org/2023/…ald-trump-christianity[/link]
[b]”Where did you get those liberal talking points?”
“I’m literally quoting Jesus Christ”[/b]
[h1]He was a top church official who criticized Trump. He says Christianity is in crisis.[/h1][blockquote] It was the result of having multiple pastors tell me, essentially, the same story about quoting the Sermon on the Mount, parenthetically, in their preaching “turn the other cheek” [and] to have someone come up after to say, “Where did you get those liberal talking points?” And what was alarming to me is that in most of these scenarios, when the pastor would say, “I’m literally quoting Jesus Christ,” the response would not be, “I apologize.” The response would be, “Yes, but that doesn’t work anymore. That’s weak.” And when we get to the point where the teachings of Jesus himself are seen as subversive to us, then we’re in a crisis.
[/blockquote] …
[blockquote] I don’t think we fix it by fighting a war for the soul of evangelicalism. I really don’t think we can fix it at the movement level. And that’s one of the reasons why, when I’m talking to Christians who are concerned about this, my counsel is always “small and local.” I think we have to do something different and show a different way. And I see in history every time that something renewing and reviving has happened, it’s happened that way. It’s happened at a small level with people simply refusing to go with the stream of the church culture at the time.
[/blockquote] [/QUOTE]
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Heard it last month on The Bulwark.
[link=https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-bulwark-podcast/id1447684472?i=1000622696581]https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-bulwark-podcast/id1447684472?i=1000622696581[/link]
Yes, all those Christians following Jesus and the Bible. Just not Jesus’s “woke” preaching, the the Sermon On The Mount.
Oh well, that leaves out the whole New Testament then. And – POOF! – no Christianity. No Evangelicals. Just religious fundamentalists & Fascists.
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