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  • Unknown Member

    Deleted User
    March 18, 2021 at 10:43 am

    And ummmmm Apple aint going to zero

    Bitcoin might

    • Unknown Member

      Deleted User
      March 18, 2021 at 10:45 am

      One thing is for sure

      You are most definitely allowed to do what you choose with your money

      Like I said good luck. Hope it works out for ya

      • donna_912

        Member
        March 18, 2021 at 4:11 pm

        Apple could go to zero. Nothing is invincible. Nothing. Lets not pretend stocks are immune here lol.

        • jennycullmann

          Member
          March 18, 2021 at 4:30 pm

          Quote from Mrdrsrow08

          Apple could go to zero. Nothing is invincible. Nothing. Lets not pretend stocks are immune here lol.

           
          These guys haven’t even looked at the FED balance sheet, the M2, the change over time; let alone comparing that to history.
           
          Then they have the nerve to act like they know what is going to happen next, or that stocks will do XYZ, or Goldman guy’s plan will work in an environment that has never been encountered ever before.
           
          Yet we are the crazy ones holding the most pristine asset of all time, the soundest money, in a world gone crazy in fake money. Ha, luck ain’t got nothing to do with it.
           
          If they ban it, I’m a billionaire in another country. So what, I don’t wanna deal with this tranny shite you guys vote for anymore, anyway. A normal place would be nice to use my money in and stop supporting you degenerates and the parasites you keep voting for.

          • Unknown Member

            Deleted User
            March 18, 2021 at 4:53 pm

            Hey Qasino Royale

            If you made so much money on Bitcoin why cant you pay me the 1500$ you owe me

            • afazio.uk_887

              Member
              March 18, 2021 at 5:01 pm

              If one were interested is buying 1 Bitcoin just for kicks how would one do that? I am clueless about this stuff

              • leann2001nl

                Member
                March 18, 2021 at 5:16 pm

                There are many exchanges where you can do it, such as a coinbase (would use pro), kraken, etc. Would check out fees, kraken is generally lowest fees. 1 bitcoin is around 57k so that’s a decent chunk of change (obviously relative to how much you’re worth). Can easily buy fractions as well like .1 or whatever you want. 
                 
                Would also look into custody of bitcoin keys before you make a plunge like that, cold storage, etc 

                • Melenas

                  Member
                  March 20, 2021 at 11:03 am

                  Will others follow Teslas lead and allow bitcoin for car purchase? 

  • btomba_77

    Member
    March 24, 2021 at 6:51 am

    [link=https://thehill.com/business-a-lobbying/business-a-lobbying/544661-tesla-buyers-can-purchase-vehicles-with-bitcoin-musk]Tesla buyers can purchase vehicles with bitcoin, Musk says[/link]

  • AcutelyObtuse

    Member
    March 24, 2021 at 6:56 am

    Kraken, Coinbase, and Gemini are all legit exchanges. If it’s just 1 bitcoin, I wouldn’t worry about sending it to a non-custodial wallet. Just keep it on the exchange and forget about it for a few years. Also, don’t sell it or swap it for at least 1 year or you will be paying >40% on your gains.
     

    Quote from Waduh Dong

    If one were interested is buying 1 Bitcoin just for kicks how would one do that? I am clueless about this stuff

    • Dr_Cocciolillo

      Member
      March 24, 2021 at 7:11 am

      Coinbase pro is fdic insured. Fees are high at .35 percent vs other exchanges. But easiest and safest.

      Other exchanges have far better interfaces and function along with lower fees

  • Unknown Member

    Deleted User
    March 25, 2021 at 6:16 am

    A Bitcoin ETF?

    Do You mean crypto ETF?

    Why would one by a Bitcoin ETF and pay ETF fees

    When they could buy Bitcoin with no additional fee

    • leann2001nl

      Member
      March 25, 2021 at 7:19 am

      Because you can’t buy bitcoin easily in most tax-deferred accounts like you can with ETF. You can do it if you really want but average joe not going to go to that trouble.
       
      They’re going to be literal ETFs that just buy bitcoin. Obviously yes there is a fee. Also they will store it for you which is attractive for people as economies of scale dictate that they can have more secure methods of storage than joe investor with his usb stick or having it on an exchange. 

      • Unknown Member

        Deleted User
        March 25, 2021 at 8:19 am

        As my father in law say

        This is why the big boys make money

        Charge fees and take absolutely no risk

        • leann2001nl

          Member
          March 25, 2021 at 8:30 am

          No risk? They have to custody the coins and it will be a race for lower fees just like with current mutual funds. 
           
          If you can’t see why people would be interested in this then maybe you should take a step back. I really don’t think you understand things well enough to have these discussions. 

          • Unknown Member

            Deleted User
            March 25, 2021 at 9:02 am

            Hahahaha

            Custody of coins that dont exist

            I understand your point about individuals not wanting to deal with the hassles

            But custody of coins that dont exist?

            Cmon you cant be serious

            • leann2001nl

              Member
              March 25, 2021 at 9:08 am

              ok, whatever you say 
              all these institutions are just getting involved in trading these things that don’t exist. fidelity which has 5 trillion in AUM is doing it just for fun 
               
              at some point you’re just wrong. What does exist mean? A dollar of cash in your bank account is just a line of code. Does that not exist? You realize that only about 10 % of the money supply for america exists on paper currency, right? Does that not exist? 

      • btomba_77

        Member
        March 25, 2021 at 9:11 am

        Quote from IR27

        Because you can’t buy bitcoin easily in most tax-deferred accounts like you can with ETF. You can do it if you really want but average joe not going to go to that trouble.

        They’re going to be literal ETFs that just buy bitcoin. Obviously yes there is a fee. Also they will store it for you which is attractive for people as economies of scale dictate that they can have more secure methods of storage than joe investor with his usb stick or having it on an exchange. 

        Honestly, I think there might be much higher participation by retail investors if Bitcoin can be purchased on an ETF … jump in / jump out on your existing trading platform.
         
        A bit of a fee probably not too big a deterrent.

        • ljohnson_509

          Member
          March 25, 2021 at 9:20 am

          Etfs for bitcoin will simply be a way of getting in on the price movement of bitcoin. You can do that with robinhood and PayPal now. There is no ownership of bitcoin with an etf. It kind of defeats the purpose of owning bitcoin.

          • btomba_77

            Member
            March 25, 2021 at 9:22 am

            I would argue that the average retail investor using bitcoin as a diversification asset or a gold stand-in etc don’t really want to bother with ownership.
             
            Following the price action is fine, especially if that price gets un-correlated from equities and bonds over time  and/or has a predictable movement relative inflation. 

            • leann2001nl

              Member
              March 25, 2021 at 9:28 am

              ya who cares to actually own it? What do you do with owning it? The lending stuff is fading and they keep cutting rates at blockfi for example. Its going to track it and be functionally the same thing. 
               
              I can’t use robinhood or paypal with my 401k. It’s becoming a separate asset class and there’s a huge amount of money that currently has no tax-preferred ways to get into it, which will change with the ETFs. 

  • Unknown Member

    Deleted User
    March 25, 2021 at 10:00 am

    You know what

    You just go ahead and you see how long it last to invest in something that doesnt exist

    This is biggest scam since the Dot com bubble

    Fools and their money are easily parted

    But of course at some point I am just wrong because I dont 50,000$ worth of nothing

    Your arse is getting burned on this

    • Unknown Member

      Deleted User
      March 25, 2021 at 10:02 am

      Is there a a correlation between Q-Anon and Bitcoin

      Sure seems like it

      • btomba_77

        Member
        March 25, 2021 at 10:10 am

        It seems a logical overlap of the Venn diagram.
         
          There is a subset of bitcoin/crypto support from the “I don’t want the deep state knowing what I purchase” crowd which also has a healthy dose of Q.
          And there is also support from the apocalyptic “Government fiat currency is going to fail” crowd, which also overlaps to Q.
         
        And then there is the “Liberals are going to cause a hyperinflationary death spiral”  crowd… also Q.
         
         
        ___
         
        That said, none of those reasons for interest in/ support for bitcoin make it any more or les likely that it will survive /stabilize as a long term asset class.    The same things can mostly be said about gold too.

      • satyanar

        Member
        March 25, 2021 at 10:10 am

         [link=https://www.coindesk.com/goldman-applies-to-offer-notes-linked-to-an-ark-etf-that-may-have-bitcoin-exposure]https://www.coindesk.com/…-have-bitcoin-exposure[/link]
         
        Edited to provide a more informative link.

      • Unknown Member

        Deleted User
        March 25, 2021 at 10:16 am

        Oh my. Im watching this thread with major enjoyment and laughter

        I do have to add something

        For starters Bitcoin is not the biggest scam since the ditcom bubble

        The late 90s actually had some good young companies at that time many of them had good technology and either made it big like Amazon or merged into other successful venture

        No my friend Bitcoin is not a dotcom bubble

        But coin is like the derivatives of the mid 2000s. Basically some smart people packaged a bunch of worthless loans together and sold them as great investments

        Thats what Bitcoin is a big of sheet and these internet fools half which are gamers an underemployed are lapping up the sheet thinking some fantasy will continue

        Point of learning…….. when grocery store clerks, cab drivers and waiters are pumping an investment…… its probably a good idea to run away

        • Unknown Member

          Deleted User
          March 25, 2021 at 10:58 am

          Also question for the board

          Im assuming casino royal is cigar, intermittent blasting, spears etc. etc. etc

          Also affectionately known as Nostradumbarse

          • leann2001nl

            Member
            March 25, 2021 at 12:02 pm

            Nice kpack signed into the other account and is having an argument with themself

            • Unknown Member

              Deleted User
              March 25, 2021 at 12:10 pm

              If that makes you feel better you go right ahead and keep pushing those conspiracies

              You actually may be the greatest internet investor in the history of our 10,000 yr old planet

              • Unknown Member

                Deleted User
                March 25, 2021 at 12:17 pm

                That being said I do agree with the waiter and cab driver comment

                Im very fortunate to have a financially smart father-in-law

                • leann2001nl

                  Member
                  March 25, 2021 at 2:51 pm

                  I havent said anything that contradictory. I think people should have 1-10% of their assets in BTC. Otherwise am a dumb indexer. Nothing really noteworthy.

                  Its strange how you mention your father in law every other post

                  • btomba_77

                    Member
                    March 26, 2021 at 4:59 am

                    Quote from IR27

                    I havent said anything that contradictory. I think people should have 1-10% of their assets in BTC. Otherwise am a dumb indexer. Nothing really noteworthy.

                    I could se myself getting to a low single digits percentage  of crypto in my portfolio at some point.
                     
                    I’m not in rush to catch the speculative meteoric rise and potential downside risk right now while it is so volatile though.
                     
                    For me I’ll give it a couple of year and wait for some analysis to see how it correlates to other asset classes and where it fits in from a broad asset allocation point of view.

                    • leann2001nl

                      Member
                      March 26, 2021 at 5:08 am

                      [link=https://www.cfainstitute.org/-/media/documents/article/rf-brief/rfbr-cryptoassets.ashx]https://www.cfainstitute….rfbr-cryptoassets.ashx[/link]
                       
                      Decent short read that addresses some of that, the correlation with traditional asset classes does appear to be increasing, though still not huge 

                    • btomba_77

                      Member
                      March 29, 2021 at 5:44 am

                      [link]https://youtu.be/mrNOYudaMAc[/link]
                       
                      SNL explains NFTs

                    • satyanar

                      Member
                      March 29, 2021 at 9:24 pm

                      Quote from IR27

                      … the correlation with traditional asset classes does appear to be increasing, though still not huge 

                       
                      You write that as though correlation with traditional asset classes would be a positive thing. I have been hoping for an investment tool that would be non-correlative to take advantage of modern portfolio theory and be able to increase returns and decrease volatility via asset allocation and periodic rebalancing. Treasuries used to provide that versus equities. Recently this has been less so. That white paper suggests BTC may provide the opportunity now at asset values of around 2.5%

                    • leann2001nl

                      Member
                      March 30, 2021 at 3:16 am

                      No was not implying at that at all. Why would you want it to correlate, youd just invest in those instead

                    • btomba_77

                      Member
                      March 30, 2021 at 4:57 am

                      Right. The ideal would to be non-correlated.
                       
                      But predictably non-correlated without volatility. 
                       
                      That makes it a diversification/hedge asset.
                       
                      I’ll wait to learn how it works relative to the market over a couple more years before it becomes part of my retirement portfolio.

                    • satyanar

                      Member
                      March 30, 2021 at 7:07 am

                      Quote from dergon

                      Right. The ideal would to be non-correlated.

                      But predictably non-correlated without volatility. 

                      That makes it a diversification/hedge asset.

                      I’ll wait to learn how it works relative to the market over a couple more years before it becomes part of my retirement portfolio. 

                       
                      predictably non-correlated without volatility is the holy grail for sure. Treasuries used to be pretty close to that. According to the article the volatility can be dealt with by periodic rebalancing. They make pretty good case for 2.5% as a safe allocation. Keep in mind that tiny percentage only looks good now because of the tremendous past upside. Unless there is similar forward looking potential it wont provide much in the way of returns. It also wont hurt much. Somehow I doubt it will ever not be volatile. And by the time it isnt, it probably wont provide a significant positive return that is worth the risk. 

                    • satyanar

                      Member
                      March 30, 2021 at 6:52 am

                      Quote from IR27

                      No was not implying at that at all. Why would you want it to correlate, youd just invest in those instead

                      Good. Your language didnt make that clear. 

  • Unknown Member

    Deleted User
    March 25, 2021 at 3:49 pm

    I didnt know a lot about investing
    His advice has made my wife and kids and my life much easier

    Im a blessed man

    • satyanar

      Member
      March 25, 2021 at 5:39 pm

      I know quite a few “higher ups” in Goldman Sachs. I too have benefitted from their advice. Good people to have as friends and family members. I wouldn’t want to do what they do though. 

  • benoit.elens

    Member
    March 30, 2021 at 7:18 am

    BTC is volatile to the upside, with a 200% growth compounded per annum.  I’ll take that kind of volatility any day.  Also, your horizon with BTC should be 5-10 years.  If you are looking to play with for a few months or even a year or 2, then it is not the asset for you.

    • btomba_77

      Member
      March 30, 2021 at 7:58 am

      Sounds strikingly similar to this post from 2013:
       
      “Gold is no risk. It will be 3500 within 3 years. I don’t know how you beat that investment.”
       
      So I will give the same response:
       
      Kids … be VERY wary of people that speak as if they know what the value of any asset will be in the future.
       

       Is it [i]possible[/i] that [strike]gold[/strike] bitcoin will be [strike]at 3500[/strike] up 200%  in a few years?   Sure it is. 
       
      Is it possible that …[strike]gold[/strike] bitcoin sits flat or decreases in value? Sure. 
       
      I just don’t know, and neither does [strike] [b]Cigar[/b][/strike] chuckl.  So stick with your portfolio plan for the long term. If holding some [strike] gold[/strike] bitcoin is part of it, then fine.
      [/strike]

      • leann2001nl

        Member
        March 30, 2021 at 8:38 am

        Gold going up just means inflation though, like I don’t see how gold becomes actually more valuable, we aren’t coming up with a ton of new uses for it and there’s only so much demand for jewelry. It’s fleshed out in essence. You have all these people crying there is going to be inflation yet gold is down 10% the last 6 months, so it doesn’t seem like institutions agree or they’d be grabbing it up. 
         
        BTC and crypto are not and as more institutions get involved the price goes up. Tons of people and corporations, essentially the world haven’t figured out really what it is, but lots more people trying. I don’t think it’s fleshed out 

      • benoit.elens

        Member
        March 30, 2021 at 8:59 am

        Dergon, I agree that one needs to be diversified.  But I am not saying anything about the future value of BTC (I think it will continue to go up — no guarantees on the rate of return of course)…I am just reporting its historical trend: the best performing financial asset in history.  The skeptics are going to be waiting until it is $100k, $200k before buying in?
         
        Also, why I am being confused with the many manifestations of cigar?  Please see my prior posts.  Thanks.

        • btomba_77

          Member
          March 30, 2021 at 9:13 am

          I was not implying that you are the same poster

          • jennycullmann

            Member
            March 30, 2021 at 6:32 pm

            Quote from dergon

            I was not implying that you are the same poster

             
            Why do you keep adding to your lies?
             
            Will you ever post something positive about, or give credi to, a poster you don’t happen to like — when there are many huge calls he made? It’s an interesting question just to see how dishonest you really are.

            • Unknown Member

              Deleted User
              March 30, 2021 at 6:40 pm

              Q

              • jennycullmann

                Member
                March 31, 2021 at 4:18 pm

                Ha, I’ve never talked about that psyop
                 
                There are real, far more obviously and proven conspiracies. Many are active right now.

      • jennycullmann

        Member
        March 30, 2021 at 6:28 pm

        Quote from dergon

        Sounds strikingly similar to this post from 2013:

        “Gold is no risk. It will be 3500 within 3 years. I don’t know how you beat that investment.”

        So I will give the same response:

        Kids … be VERY wary of people that speak as if they know what the value of any asset will be in the future.


        Is it [i]possible[/i] that [strike]gold[/strike] bitcoin will be [strike]at 3500[/strike] up 200%  in a few years?   Sure it is. 

        Is it possible that …[strike]gold[/strike] bitcoin sits flat or decreases in value? Sure. 

        I just don’t know, and neither does [strike] [b]Cigar[/b][/strike] chuckl.  So stick with your portfolio plan for the long term. If holding some [strike] gold[/strike] bitcoin is part of it, then fine.

         
        Wait a minute there, I’m Cigar. Ha. And I was right in the sense that gold wasn’t a risk — which it wasn’t. It went up. The 3500 was incorrect.
         
        But you guys still can’t admit I made the greatest prediction the board has ever seen. It’s because you don’t make predictions because you are afraid of life, just like with Covid. Can’t live like a man, only hide in your basement like a twat.
         
        I hope Orange Man bad circles the wagons again, just for the spectacle.

    • jennycullmann

      Member
      March 30, 2021 at 6:30 pm

      Quote from ChuckI

      BTC is volatile to the upside, with a 200% growth compounded per annum.  I’ll take that kind of volatility any day.  Also, your horizon with BTC should be 5-10 years.  If you are looking to play with for a few months or even a year or 2, then it is not the asset for you.

       
      We have told them this time and again. Are they just stupid? It’s pretty funny that people just refuse to make money. It’s typical with them though, deny reality and never give credit where it is due. Typical of Fidel and Che lovers.

  • btomba_77

    Member
    April 6, 2021 at 5:04 am

    [/h1] [link=https://www.wsj.com/articles/china-creates-its-own-digital-currency-a-first-for-major-economy-11617634118]Wall Street Journal[/link]:
     
    [b]China Creates Its Own Digital Currency, a First for Major Economy[/b][/h1]  
    [b]A cyber yuan stands to give Beijing power to track spending in real time, plus money that isnt linked to the dollar-dominated global financial system[/b][/h2]  
     
     
     
     
    A thousand years ago, when money meant coins, China invented paper currency. Now the Chinese government is minting cash digitally, in a re-imagination of money that could shake a pillar of American power.
    It might seem money is already virtual, as credit cards and payment apps such as Apple Pay in the U.S. and WeChat in China eliminate the need for bills or coins. But those are just ways to move money electronically. China is turning legal tender itself into computer code.

     

  • kaldridgewv2211

    Member
    April 6, 2021 at 7:23 am

    Since its China Im assuming this is for Nefarious purposes. Bitcoin doesnt offer full anonymity but its enabled a lot of crooks to do bad things. Im assuming Chinese government just wants another way to track everything their population does in order to maintain their iron grip on the country.

    • benoit.elens

      Member
      April 6, 2021 at 7:46 am

      Super nefarious for a state involved in active genocide of the Uighurs:
       
      “The money itself is programmable. Beijing has tested expiration dates to encourage users to spend it quickly, for times when the economy needs a jump-start.
       
      Its also trackable, adding another tool to Chinas [link=https://www.wsj.com/articles/the-all-seeing-surveillance-state-feared-in-the-west-is-a-reality-in-china-1498493020?mod=article_inline]heavy state surveillance[/link]. The government deploys [link=https://www.wsj.com/articles/a-billion-surveillance-cameras-forecast-to-be-watching-within-two-years-11575565402?mod=hp_listb_pos1&mod=article_inline]hundreds of millions of facial-recognition cameras[/link] to monitor its population, sometimes using them to levy fines for activities such as jaywalking. A digital currency would make it possible to both mete out and collect fines as soon as an infraction was detected.”

    • jennycullmann

      Member
      April 6, 2021 at 6:00 pm

      Quote from DICOM_Dan

      Since its China Im assuming this is for Nefarious purposes. Bitcoin doesnt offer full anonymity but its enabled a lot of crooks to do bad things. Im assuming Chinese government just wants another way to track everything their population does in order to maintain their iron grip on the country.

       
      The implicit trust of the US gov’t here is laughable. Quid pro Joe was bought by China, and many other politicians you vote for, long ago, Dicom. Do you really not know that? Or just try to forget it at night?
       
      Cash enables crooks to “do bad things”. Just stop.
       
      Your boy Larry Summers wants to ban $100 bills too. You don’t think the US is gonna go CBDC? LOL, you really are naive.

  • leann2001nl

    Member
    April 9, 2021 at 5:47 am

    Yes Im sure every bank that is getting involved is duped but Joe Schmo radiologist figured it out. If only the people at JP Morgan were as smart

    • leann2001nl

      Member
      April 9, 2021 at 5:49 am

      Few to no real world usage, which is why billions of dollars are being transferred on the blockchain. Whatever though.

      Easy, lazy move is to say everything is a bubble. Harder thing is to acknowledge when youre wrong or say we will know its a bubble by X date. People have said Tesla is overvalued forever yet here we are.

      • leann2001nl

        Member
        April 9, 2021 at 5:55 am

        The funny thing is the people who say BTC is a bubble don’t understand how it works. 
         
        To know the value of something you have to have an understand of what exactly it is and how it works. I’ve never heard someone that can explain how blockchain tech works say BTC is a bubble. I wonder why. 
         
        Again, very easy to be lazy and say no inherent value and unlimited code(which is not true for BTC or lots of other cryptos). Harder to actually know what you’re talking about and say ” I think this has limited potential or will blow up because XYZ.” 

        • benoit.elens

          Member
          April 9, 2021 at 8:57 am

          99% of altcoins are scams and should NOT be compared to Bitcoin.  Apples and oranges.

          • Unknown Member

            Deleted User
            April 9, 2021 at 9:34 am

            The difference between the US dollar and Bitcoin

            And the difference between any public traded stock

            Is its backed up by something

            The dollar is backed up the US Government

            A share of stock is backed up by its company

            Bitcoin is nothing backed up by nothing

            Now you can make the argument that the US government is worthless or that share of stock of is worthless if you want but thats just argument to make you feel better

            I dont think bubble is quite the word to describe Bitcoin

            I think scam is more appropriate term

            • Unknown Member

              Deleted User
              April 9, 2021 at 9:41 am

              But I broke my own new rule

              You cant argue with stupid

              You cant make a waiter or hairdresser from believing a Covid vaccine will change their DNA and you cant make internet investing gurus jumping on the next hot thing realized they are jumping off a cliff

              • Unknown Member

                Deleted User
                April 9, 2021 at 9:42 am

                But I broke my own new rule

                You cant argue with stupid

                You cant stop a waiter or hairdresser from believing a Covid vaccine will change their DNA and you cant make internet investing gurus who are pumping and jumping on the next hot thing realize they are jumping off a cliff

                You just cant fix stupid

                • kathleen.hibler

                  Member
                  April 9, 2021 at 9:57 am

                  People never want to spend it, even though its a currency

                  I see no problem in a small speculative holding, but I dont understand what benefits it has over any other digital currency

                  • btomba_77

                    Member
                    April 9, 2021 at 10:17 am

                    [link=https://www.bloomberg.com/opinion/articles/2021-04-09/bitcoin-is-displacing-gold-as-an-inflation-hedge?srnd=premium]Bitcoin Is Displacing Gold as an Inflation Hedge[/link][/h3]  

                    Joshi contends that this shows demand for gold over silver is driven by its perception as a superior anti-fiat asset. If people are worried about the long-term buying power of government-issued currencies, they will be prepared to pay more for gold, with its perceived role as a store of value. How then do we explain golds sudden fall in silver terms over the last year?
                     
                    The Joshi argument is that bitcoin has risen as an alternative anti-fiat asset. It has been popular because of the libertarian anti-government ideas that have accompanied the digital currency since its inception. Bitcoins increase in scale to become better known and much easier to obtain now makes it a much more viable competitor for the shiny metal. 
                     
                    There is circumstantial evidence that some money has flowed directly from gold into bitcoin.
                     
                     

                     
                    The current drive in bitcoin therefore looks like a bid to protect against currency debasement, by means of a measured transfer from gold, which is deemed the weaker anti-fiat asset for the moment. 
                     
                    If this is what is motivating people to buy bitcoin, with resurgence in fears of debasement and inflation accounting for its persistent recovery after crashes, the question of exactly how we should value it remains. 
                     
                     
                    ..
                    For now, bitcoin fills a demand for a wider array of alternatives to fiat currencies at a time when many are deeply skeptical of monetary policy, while also promising the kind of exciting growth that tech stocks have done. Its understandable that there would be wide demand for such an asset. And while that demand is strong, it is aided by that other universal force in markets; fear of missing out. If reflation doesnt come through on cue, however, it might be as well to brace for another bitcoin bump.

                     
                    This seems like a fair take.  Potential of “getting in early” FoMo and anti-fiat / anti-inflation hedge.

                    • Unknown Member

                      Deleted User
                      April 9, 2021 at 10:52 am

                      Yep. I agree
                      And it explains why the Qanon type and those previously known as strict liberatarians are pumping it

                      Its a big FU to the government by the government haters

  • donna_912

    Member
    April 9, 2021 at 11:24 am

    Not wanting to spend bitcoin is not an argument against its value, its an argument for it. Bitcoin will become the ultimate collateral and be used for lending. You wont even have to sell your bitcoin. Blockfi and coinbase are already doing this. In ten years, all fintech players will offer loans at lower rates than traditional banks using your own bitcoin as collateral.

    • benoit.elens

      Member
      April 9, 2021 at 11:47 am

      A lot of people FUDding BTC will be adding it to their portfolios when it is 5 times the current price.

      • Unknown Member

        Deleted User
        April 9, 2021 at 12:32 pm

        Or a lot of people will dump it when it goes back to 5000$

        • Unknown Member

          Deleted User
          April 9, 2021 at 12:46 pm

          Removed due to GDPR request

          • Unknown Member

            Deleted User
            April 9, 2021 at 1:20 pm

            Ok

            You should go all in on Bitcoin

            • Unknown Member

              Deleted User
              April 9, 2021 at 1:26 pm

              Removed due to GDPR request

              • Unknown Member

                Deleted User
                April 9, 2021 at 1:28 pm

                And your posting on anonymous radiology message board

                No you dont quit lying about stupid sheet

                • Unknown Member

                  Deleted User
                  April 9, 2021 at 1:34 pm

                  Removed due to GDPR request

                  • Unknown Member

                    Deleted User
                    April 9, 2021 at 1:39 pm

                    Spending too much time under volcano

                    Perhaps the gas from it has affected your senses

                    • Unknown Member

                      Deleted User
                      April 9, 2021 at 1:41 pm

                      Under THE volcano

  • Unknown Member

    Deleted User
    April 9, 2021 at 1:42 pm

    Removed due to GDPR request

    • Unknown Member

      Deleted User
      April 9, 2021 at 1:45 pm

      Well it fits

      An angry drunkard mad at the world suspicions of government and authorities is a perfect individual to pump Bitcoin

      Same as the Q-Anon type or the disgruntled libertarians

      Good luck with your lonesome

      • Unknown Member

        Deleted User
        April 9, 2021 at 1:48 pm

        Removed due to GDPR request

      • benoit.elens

        Member
        April 9, 2021 at 1:50 pm

        Chiro, you finally outed yourself as kpack after the “sheet” spelling of excrement.  Anyways, as I mentioned earlier in this thread and now Geoffrey Firmin did, please do a deep dive and educated yourself on BTC.   I am not trying to be condescending but knowledge is power here.  If you still think it’s sheet, then at least you will have a well-informed opinion and a legitimate reason to hate on it.

        • Unknown Member

          Deleted User
          April 9, 2021 at 1:51 pm

          Outed?

          Ok

          • Unknown Member

            Deleted User
            April 9, 2021 at 1:53 pm

            And Chiro is Latin for of the hand

            My fellowship in MSK had a huge hand clinic

            Not hard to figure out who I am

            • Unknown Member

              Deleted User
              April 9, 2021 at 2:04 pm

              Removed due to GDPR request

              • leann2001nl

                Member
                April 9, 2021 at 2:19 pm

                hes a troll. got banned before and back on another name 
                 
                surprised he didnt talk about his father in law yet 

                • Unknown Member

                  Deleted User
                  April 9, 2021 at 2:25 pm

                  I dont believe Ive been banned

                  Trolling

                  Maybe a little

                  Father in law. Wells hes a good guy

                  • Unknown Member

                    Deleted User
                    April 9, 2021 at 2:28 pm

                    I guess I upset the Q-Anon errrrrrr I mean Bitcoin gods on the board

                    Back to my hole

                • leann2001nl

                  Member
                  April 9, 2021 at 3:12 pm

                  It hasnt been 5k in two years. It likely will never hit 5k again. 

                  • kathleen.hibler

                    Member
                    April 9, 2021 at 4:40 pm

                    March 13 2020 was 2 years ago ?

                    • leann2001nl

                      Member
                      April 9, 2021 at 4:49 pm

                      lowest I see is ~ 5400 back then? Maybe the charts are averaging weeks and for a day or two it dipped below 5k? if so I will own my error. 

                    • benoit.elens

                      Member
                      April 9, 2021 at 5:59 pm

                      It dipped into the high 3k’s during COVID.  It was a black swan event which crushed everything.  It’s up ~15x since then.

                  • jennycullmann

                    Member
                    April 10, 2021 at 9:10 am

                    Quote from IR27

                    It hasnt been 5k in two years. It likely will never hit 5k again. 

                     
                    It will never hit 20k again, and I don’t think there is much of a chance it gets into the 30s, or even 40s again.

                    • ljohnson_509

                      Member
                      April 10, 2021 at 9:44 am

                      ^^ quite a statement never 20-40k. That makes bitcoin safer then the us stock market which has fallen 30-50% several times since 2008.

                    • jennycullmann

                      Member
                      April 11, 2021 at 11:13 am

                      Quote from Drrad123

                      ^^ quite a statement never 20-40k. That makes bitcoin safer then the us stock market which has fallen 30-50% several times since 2008.

                       
                      My position is that BTC is safer, especially given current stock market valuations, which of course also reflect inflation expectations (and are inflated by Fed/QE policies).

                    • kayla.meyer_144

                      Member
                      April 12, 2021 at 8:14 am

                      Quote from Drrad123

                      ^^ quite a statement never 20-40k. That makes bitcoin safer then the us stock market which has fallen 30-50% several times since 2008.

                      This is nothing but a speculation investment akin to going to the casino & betting with the bookies on how the patrons will be betting, nothing deeper.
                       
                      Bookies are not safer bets than betting on the stock markets. As bad as the markets are illogical or manipulated sometimes, at least you can get rational information to use in order to make logical decisions betting on companies or sectors or funds/ETFs.
                       
                      What logic do you get with Bitcoin? Herd investing & FOMO? It’s not even gold or platinum which have inherent value. The inherent value of Bitcoin is what? That it has increased enormously in spite of what exactly?
                       
                      This is a FOMO bet, nothing more. An ETF just makes it easier to bet on Bitcoin FOMO. The inherent value is not there outside of the herd.
                       
                      Unless someone can enlighten me what I’m missing? And don’t lose your password.

                    • leann2001nl

                      Member
                      April 12, 2021 at 8:19 am

                      What is with the Q-anon crap? Talking about a speculative asset makes you a conspiracy private chatroom whackjob? Such a strange argument. 
                       
                      Are the people who buy gold Q-Anon whackjobs? 
                       
                      Its fine if you disagree and want to let father in law run your stuff. Run along and let the grown ups talk. 

                    • Unknown Member

                      Deleted User
                      April 12, 2021 at 8:56 am

                      The same people on here pumping Bitcoin are the same people pumping hydroxychloroquine last year this time and all the other conspiracy based stuff in between

                      Think about it

                      It fits. The end of the world doom and bloomer anti government types are the ones pumping Bitcoin

                      Same people

                    • Unknown Member

                      Deleted User
                      April 12, 2021 at 8:58 am

                      Are the people who buy gold Q-Anon whack jobs

                      Hahahaha you really want to go there

                      Ask your buddy casino Royale/cigar/intermittent blasting etc

                      Hahahaha

                    • btomba_77

                      Member
                      April 12, 2021 at 9:02 am

                      disclaimer .. I do [b]not[/b] think that all people who consider Bitcoin a viable investment option are crazy….and I think it is distinctly possible that there is a role for BTC in a conventional retirement portfolio.

                      But…

                      [link=https://www.ft.com/content/59c03a8e-2b6e-45d2-bf28-744391ffa372]https://www.ft.com/conten…45d2-bf28-744391ffa372[/link]

                      Both bitcoin and QAnon hail from the similar anonymous message board systems. Both have also propagated thanks to a core community of known advocates who invested resources to expand and popularise the message.

                      Both stem from the conspiratorial realm. Bitcoin is focused on the idea that the financial system is a corrupt intermediary whose true agenda is to control of the money supply, and further its own empowerment. QAnon is predicated on the conspiracy that the government, and all other notable institutions, have been infiltrated by untrustworthy elements whose true agenda is their own empowerment at the cost of the peoples.

                      Both are centred on myth-making and encourage belief systems that keep their communities ever waiting for a promised Storm or a Mooning event.

                      Both are remarkably resilient to disappointment of their predictions failing. In bitcoins case theres the ongoing failed prediction that the cryptocurrency will displace the dollar, while in QAnons case theres the unrealised prophecies of mass arrests, or JFK Jr resurrecting in July. In both cases the community takes the failures on the chin, rises to the challenge and doubles down.

                      Both have a certain viral propagation to them designed to reward “early adopters” with promises of forward knowledge to a sure thing. When the dollar crashes, the bitcoin will be rewarded with the cryptographic keys to the fortunes of the world, and when the deep state is rumbled, the QAnons will be rewarded with the opportunity to propel their candidate of choice to the top of the power pyramid. The two factions mantras, Nobody can stop bitcoin and nothing can stop whats coming, are also extremely similar. (The latter is a particularly nonsense phrase).

                      Both movements draw heavily on meme warfare, logos and a cottage industry of branded merchandise, sophisticated propaganda and video/ media resources which tug on emotions to spread their message far and wide, and to help community members identify each other.

                      Both bitcoin and QAnon utilise the power of online evangelists, bot accounts and brigades to recruit or radicalise new members.

                      -_____

                      [link=https://www.wsj.com/articles/gamestop-bitcoin-and-qanon-how-the-wisdom-of-crowds-became-the-anarchy-of-the-mob-11611928823]https://www.wsj.com/artic…of-the-mob-11611928823[/link]

                      GameStop, Bitcoin and QAnon: How the Wisdom of Crowds Became the Anarchy of the Mob

                      But this is a tale of something much bigger and more consequential than the fate of a single stonk, I mean stock, or even, as homebound day traders look for other quick wins, a handful of them. Whats happening on WallStreetBets is of a piece with other internet phenomena, from bitcoin mania to the online conspiracy theories of QAnon, and the events leading up to the Capitol riot.

                    • leann2001nl

                      Member
                      April 12, 2021 at 9:24 am

                      myth-making? What exactly is the myth-making of bitcoin? People who invest in stuff have a vested interest in it doing well, who knew. How exactly is this different than literally anything else in the world?
                       
                      Early adopters of anything are rewarded. If you bought apple 20 years ago, you’re rich now, does that make it similar to Qanon? 
                       
                      Meme warefare and branded bitcoin merchandise? I’ve never seen bitcoin branded anything. 
                       
                      I think this is trying to make a bunch of connections where there aren’t. ya people who are distrustful of system are probably more likely to be interested in BTC. That doesn’t mean they are Qanon followers. 
                       
                      I guess JP Morgan, Microstrategy, Tesla, etc are all Qanon followers now. 
                       

                    • benoit.elens

                      Member
                      April 12, 2021 at 9:44 am

                      So must be Mass Mutual, Elon Musk,  Chamath Palihapitiya, Jack Dorsey, Square, Raoul Pal, Ray Dalio, Paul Tudor Jones, Cathie Wood, Reid Hoffman, and the Harvard/Yale/Brown endowment fund managers.

                    • Unknown Member

                      Deleted User
                      April 12, 2021 at 9:50 am

                      Sounds like many of you have hit the next big thing

                      Great job

                    • leann2001nl

                      Member
                      April 12, 2021 at 10:01 am

                      Maybe, maybe not but it would be helpful for discussions if people could just talk about it without trying to lump people into fringe conspiracy groups 

  • Unknown Member

    Deleted User
    April 9, 2021 at 2:40 pm

    But first one last quote

    “Bitcoin is a speculative commodity with no use case,” said David Gerard, an author of two books on cryptocurrency and blockchain. “There is nothing you can do with Bitcoin except sell it on to someone else. It’s like a great big game of hot potato with a price tag.”

    • Unknown Member

      Deleted User
      April 9, 2021 at 3:10 pm

      Removed due to GDPR request

    • jennycullmann

      Member
      April 10, 2021 at 9:09 am

      Quote from Chirorad84

      But first one last quote

      “Bitcoin is a speculative commodity with no use case,” said David Gerard, an author of two books on cryptocurrency and blockchain. “There is nothing you can do with Bitcoin except sell it on to someone else. It’s like a great big game of hot potato with a price tag.”

       
      This is the kind of stuff we have to deal with, and why you see such bluster coming from a side, or both sides, or whatever. It’s brainless, absolutely stupid to say “there is no use case.”
       
      Does this guy know the first thing about btc or blockchain or the current state of banking, fiat, world currencies? It’s unreal.

  • jennycullmann

    Member
    April 11, 2021 at 11:15 am

    By the way, the quote was never 20k, so please quote ideas accurately. Low chance (less than 20%) that it hits 30s.

    • donna_912

      Member
      April 12, 2021 at 5:46 am

      I hope it dips into the 30s one more time. Would love to buy more.

      • ljohnson_509

        Member
        April 12, 2021 at 6:26 am

        I dont think many would be surprised if it was 100k next year or 4k.

        The longer bitcoin is dominant and the higher the price , the more appealing it is.

        Whats kind of disturbing is that many other coins have the same functionality as bitcoin. Its mainly a name brand. It humans buy bags for thousands from Vuitton and much less from Walmart.

        • leann2001nl

          Member
          April 12, 2021 at 7:22 am

          4k would be surprising. 30k? not so much 
           
           It’s about fundamental differences that make BTC better for various purposes. If thats your outlook about brand name then I really don’t think you understand crypto or how various cryptos are different from one another. Sure there is some first-mover advantage but it’s also the best solution to the original problem. its the most simple and is the prototypical cryptocurrency for that reason. 
           
          A fancy purse may have better materials but yes it’s mainly about the name and functionally carries your credit card or wallet just like another one would. BTC operates functionally different than other cryptos, namely in lack of centralization and inherent limitations in number of transactions due to its simplicity, which allow anyone to run a node and theoretically partake. There are pros and cons to how various cryptocurrencies are made which give them advantages and disadvantages. 
           
          Again though if all you think is name brand difference then you should read more about it. There is way more to it than that. 

          • Unknown Member

            Deleted User
            April 12, 2021 at 7:57 am

            As the Q-Anon types say

            Educate yourself

            AKA- read some BS that you want to believe and repeat as fact

        • arg2626

          Member
          April 12, 2021 at 12:24 pm

          I agree with what some posters have mentioned. Bitcoin is quite unique. Compare Bitcoin and other most popular cryptocurrencies, one difference that stood out is that Bitcoin stubbornly kept its transaction limit per block low. More miners are competing with each other to seal the transaction blocks, essentially increasing the computing cost to mine. This has the effect of increasing the security of the transaction and making Bitcoin well suited as digital storage of value, digital Gold. Other cryptocurrencies like Bitcoin Cash or Ether do the opposite- they are made to handle large number of transactions to keep costs low. It has also been said that Bitcoin is good for the settlement layer, the preferred medium for large institutions to balance their accounts between each other periodically.
           
          To be fair, for the same reasons, Bitcoin is not good as the medium of exchange for day to day personal expenses. For this purpose, Bitcoin cash and Ether are unmistakably better. But there are many people working on infrastructures to tackle this problem. One example is Liquid network from Blockstream- take some bitcoins out and put it in some kind of escrow and then open up side chains to handle smaller transactions. As the technology mature, there may be multiple secondary or tertiary sidechains operating off the bitcoin main blockchain to make Bitcoin a more versatile option.
           
          That said, it is easy enough for someone to create a brand new cryptocurrency that works and behaves just like Bitcoin- the entire code base is open source! However, I believe that if a coin poised to take over bitcoin shows up one day, it can’t overtake bitcoin overnight. There’ll be lots of grey rhinos and warnings. I’m keeping an eye out and hopefully pull out long before that happens.
           

          Quote from Drrad123

          I dont think many would be surprised if it was 100k next year or 4k.

          The longer bitcoin is dominant and the higher the price , the more appealing it is.

          Whats kind of disturbing is that many other coins have the same functionality as bitcoin. Its mainly a name brand. It humans buy bags for thousands from Vuitton and much less from Walmart.

          • kayla.meyer_144

            Member
            April 12, 2021 at 1:10 pm

            The one irony I see in Bitcoin is what exactly is the difference between a government increasing the money supply (a bad thing) and investors pushing up the “value” of an individual monetary instrument, a Bitcoin up in value by magnitudes. When Bitcoin started it had a value of $0.0009 per unit. So what is driving up a monetary unit that much in 12 years? Value like gold? And it represents an honest system compared to the banks & Federal Reserves of the world?
             
            Maybe I’m missing everything about cryptocurrency  but I can’t say I see Bitcoin solving any real world problems. It is speculation & betting in the purest form.

            • leann2001nl

              Member
              April 12, 2021 at 1:35 pm

              There is def speculation but it also does solve problems so yes you are missing that.

              Heres a starter , if I want to send 500 bucks to my buddy in Japan , how long does that take under traditional banking schemes ? How many days before the transaction is settled? Now, lets say I want to do it at 8 pm.

              At face value, if it truly did nothing dont you think the giant central banks who have researched it wouldnt want a piece of it ? It would be paradoxical for them to be involved if it had no use. Crypto is used to transfer literally billions of dollars of value right now

              • leann2001nl

                Member
                April 12, 2021 at 1:37 pm

                People transfer hundreds of millions to low billions for single digit dollar transaction fees, like what other medium is that possible on ?

                • kayla.meyer_144

                  Member
                  April 12, 2021 at 1:47 pm

                  So transfer is immediate and the fee for the interaction is zero?
                   
                  What’s the catch?

  • benoit.elens

    Member
    April 12, 2021 at 9:22 am

    There is a lot of misinformation in this thread – it is really hard to go point by point and try to correct each take.  One point worth noting is that no other coin has the properties of bitcoin (not even close), it is the only decentralized coin, period. 
     
    I think this article is applicable to this cohort.  BTW, we as physicians, are quite risk averse and bitcoin challenges us for that very reason.
     
    [link=https://www.citadel21.com/why-the-yuppie-elite-dismiss-bitcoin]https://www.citadel21.com…-elite-dismiss-bitcoin[/link]

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