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  • yoyo_medicine_958

    Member
    April 12, 2023 at 11:09 am

    For what it is worth I have been offered by local senior leadership somewhat formally to go above salary cap by incentive so it seems the ceiling now at least has holes.

    • pbernard_996

      Member
      April 12, 2023 at 11:30 am

      Base salary over 400, or over 400 after adding the performance bonus?

      • yoyo_medicine_958

        Member
        April 12, 2023 at 11:51 am

        Base salary near cap. Offered incentive x years with predominantly amount of incentive over cap.

    • buckeyeguy

      Member
      April 12, 2023 at 12:17 pm

      Quote from gladraddad

      For what it is worth I have been offered by local senior leadership somewhat formally to go above salary cap by incentive so it seems the ceiling now at least has holes.

       
      Do you have to know them though? That’s what was so disappointing about VAs in general, they were far less national and far more local fiefdoms where connections led to riding easy jobs into the sunset, far more than getting a well trained rad that was desired in the listing …

      • yoyo_medicine_958

        Member
        May 11, 2023 at 11:13 am

        I have heard that 50% incentives are now possible due to the Pact act but havent recieved confirmation on this. I know previously it used to be 25% for up to 4 years. Has anyone else heard anything about that?

        • haleemichelle

          Member
          May 12, 2023 at 4:16 pm

          I’m a young VA IR, 5 years into practice. PP first 2 years, then COVID layoffs happened from a predominantly DR group.
           
          Joined the VA I trained at. I make just shy of 400k from the VA, teach fellows, get one half day a week, have a PA for clinic and baby procedures, and have a great rapport with the other IRs. I take uncompensated call more than I like but its light and fellows field all the calls. I make private practice salary when adding in my tele work and still have lots of flexibility with my life.

          Forgot to mention the most important part. I can almost always take a couple hours off during the workday on short notice to attend my kids school events, recitals, etc. In private practice (at least the group I was at), they would have a heart attack and partners would probably bash me if I asked for any time off outside of my planned vacation weeks.
           
          Each VA is different. I can see myself doing this while my kids are young.
           
          Cheers.

          • abd.fawzi_217

            Member
            May 12, 2023 at 4:29 pm

            How often are you doing telework and for how long?

            • haleemichelle

              Member
              May 14, 2023 at 6:05 pm

              Work about 8-10 days a month between evenings and weekends. I think this would be more exhausting if I was doing diag during the day.

              This way I get to keep both my ir and dr skills up to date.

              • loli.amaral_506

                Member
                May 17, 2023 at 4:16 pm

                How are y’alls thoughts on how well federal jobs will weather future automation in jobs? It has to be more secure than private practice right?

          • mgmacielendocrino_912

            Member
            May 13, 2023 at 5:51 pm

            Quote from cooolguy

            I’m a young VA IR, 5 years into practice. PP first 2 years, then COVID layoffs happened from a predominantly DR group.

            Joined the VA I trained at. I make just shy of 400k from the VA, teach fellows, get one half day a week, have a PA for clinic and baby procedures, and have a great rapport with the other IRs. I take uncompensated call more than I like but its light and fellows field all the calls. I make private practice salary when adding in my tele work and still have lots of flexibility with my life. Also, no contract..

            Each VA is different. I can see myself doing this for a while.

            Cheers.

            How do you get so much time to do tele work to make PP money?  

          • arthie.jeyakumar

            Member
            May 11, 2024 at 12:33 am

            Hello would like to hear more about how you incorporate diagnostics into your life as an IR. Thanks so much!

  • jeroen.maas_791

    Member
    May 13, 2023 at 8:25 pm

     
    I exist.

  • yoyo_medicine_958

    Member
    May 22, 2023 at 9:44 pm

    Based on my interpretation the Dushom said something like the 4 year 25% incentives over the cap allowed by the pact act should be in place va wide by the end of the year.

    I have heard some rumors and/or paperwork potentially allowing for 50% incentives for 5 or 6 years but not confirmed.

    [link=https://federalnewsnetwork.com/hiring-retention/2023/05/vha-tells-facilities-to-implement-most-pact-act-workforce-authorities-by-years-end/?readmore=1]https://federalnewsnetwor…-years-end/?readmore=1[/link]

    • buckeyeguy

      Member
      May 23, 2023 at 7:17 am

      So they’ll finally start raising salaries by the time we hit hyperinflation …
       
      yay

  • alex.nieto_484

    Member
    June 30, 2023 at 1:04 pm

    Last I checked the VA RVU goal is around 6000. $400,000 at that level of productivity seems like a great deal. If the VA starts paying $600,000 it would be one of the best jobs in the country.

    • ghuang920

      Member
      June 30, 2023 at 2:49 pm

      Its more of a long term concern, due to the effects of inflation over the years. Again, Im looking for VA rads who have some real info on this. 

    • Unknown Member

      Deleted User
      July 7, 2023 at 6:36 am

      Quote from RadCog

      Last I checked the VA RVU goal is around 6000. $400,000 at that level of productivity seems like a great deal. If the VA starts paying $600,000 it would be one of the best jobs in the country.

      This is 66 per wrvu. 60 is 90th percentile. Almost no groups get this kind of comp. Lets hope the gov isn’t this stupid- but if they are sign me up.

      • Unknown Member

        Deleted User
        July 7, 2023 at 11:54 am

        Best gig on a per study basis, VA.  Worst case on an hourly basis, VA.  You can just do 30 rvu in a day and then go home, you have to stay there for the full shift.  Works out to about only $175-$200/hr, you still want to sign up?  You can read 100 rvu per day or 30, pay is the same.  

        • yoyo_medicine_958

          Member
          July 13, 2023 at 8:20 pm

          Know of at least one VA sending out broad emails to radiologists from HR advertising 25% incentive. Know of at least a few VAs officially offering 25% incentives to radiologists. Seems to be this is now attainable at a decent amount of VA locations for radiologists.

          • abstone38_669

            Member
            July 14, 2023 at 4:58 am

            ^^what do mean by incentives? 25% pay hike?

            Are va starting salaries going up with the market as well?

            • g.giancaspro_108

              Member
              July 14, 2023 at 7:41 am

              With due respect, a 25% increase still does not make these salaries competitive.
               
              If the VA is serious about staffing, they will need to offer at minimum a compensation package that is competitive.  The appeal of the mission will only go so far in recruiting, and the current situation shows that is not far enough.

              • seb_arrosa_904

                Member
                July 14, 2023 at 9:16 am

                another problem with the VA system is that credentialing is such a pain ( fingerprinting, needless nonrelevant paperwork etc)  Nobody wants to bother with government stupidity so that some administration can justify its existence, so people take other jobs

                • marcioradiologia2_129

                  Member
                  July 15, 2023 at 5:17 pm

                  Some places seem to have very little self awareness or respect to the applicant about such things. Made even worse by requiring on site presence during weekday work hours, forcing the applicant to take PTO during their residency/fellowship to fulfill these requirements. Same thing to be said for academic places or other large institutions requiring things like diversity essays and such and then wonder why people don’t even apply to their programs.

  • sandeepvel_172

    Member
    July 2, 2023 at 7:30 am

    I exist

  • Drthekra

    Member
    July 7, 2023 at 11:52 pm

    uh, has anyone noticed a delay in pay deposits this week? 

  • g.giancaspro_108

    Member
    August 5, 2023 at 11:36 am

    To be fair, this sounds like PP radiology also, but your point is taken.
     

    Quote from LKT

     the massive increase in volume, stagnant salaries, reliance on low quality mid levels who shotgun even basic stuff (my patient has years of back pain so I need MRI of C/T/L/bilateral hips/bilateral knees with and without contrast)

  • alex.nieto_484

    Member
    August 14, 2023 at 7:20 am

    Quote from randomrad

    Serious answer from a VA rad: volumes are up 60-80% since 2013, depending on modality.  Increasing reliance on in-house imaging (instead of “community care”) for PET, MR, LDCT for LCS, and pain intervention will result in an additional 40-50% increase over the next 2 years.  VA National mandates, market competition, and demographic changes have put some of our radiology departments in tough circumstances for near-term staffing.  I’m worried about a “critical mass” of increasing workload beyond the expected VA standards leading to short order retirement of multiple VA rads.  Also, I’m told that NTP is not currently taking new business, so there is no internal safety net to account for personnel losses in the near-term.  To be clear, VA radiology has a lot of regional and local variability in workload and staffing, so these trends may not be universal.  

     
    Do you have any source for this information? 
     
    If the VA RVU goal is 5.5k rads aren’t going to start cranking out 13k because of staffing shortages. That isn’t how the incentives for the VA work and rads who like to read efficiently don’t generally join the VA.

    • abstone38_669

      Member
      August 14, 2023 at 7:22 am

      ^^ thats not true

      One va I interviewed at had shortages and the extra work and shifts fell on the remaining rads. Work has to get done.

      • alex.nieto_484

        Member
        August 14, 2023 at 7:41 am

        Quote from astone38

        ^^ thats not true

        One va I interviewed at had shortages and the extra work and shifts fell on the remaining rads. Work has to get done.

        Every VA is different. That is not how the 1 I worked for operated.

    • janamicb_883

      Member
      August 14, 2023 at 11:23 am

      Could someone clarify where the 5.5k or 6k expectation number came from? Is this a national thing or does this vary from location to location?
       
      Also, is it RVU, wRVU, or some other productivity metric?

      • y.rajshekar

        Member
        August 14, 2023 at 1:52 pm

        Every time we are short, the work falls on the rads who shown up. Work has to be done. 

      • rgiles912_432

        Member
        August 14, 2023 at 1:52 pm

        Current FY 2023 RVU productivity goals.
        Level 1 a,b,c (larger facilities): 6084
        Levle2,3 (Medium and small facilities):5998
        These RVU marks are for 1.0 FTE  Most Rads are mapped as 80-95% clinical, so the actual goal is reduced accordingly.  Chiefs are mapped anywhere from 20 to 70% clinical in my experience.

        • abstone38_669

          Member
          August 14, 2023 at 2:06 pm

          ^^ and likely nothing happens if you fall short of the goal.

          This is also true at other jobs as long as you miss the mark reasonably

          • rgiles912_432

            Member
            August 14, 2023 at 2:12 pm

            I have not seen any individual repercussions for missing the marks, except possibly missing out on a portion of your yearly bonus, but productivity reviews mostly disappeared since Covid. Although next fiscal year starts in October so productivity penalties could happen.  The facility leadership has to answer to the regional network if any department is below 25th percentile for productivity.  

            • y.rajshekar

              Member
              August 14, 2023 at 3:43 pm

              Quote from Osseon

              I have not seen any individual repercussions for missing the marks, except possibly missing out on a portion of your yearly bonus, but productivity reviews mostly disappeared since Covid. Although next fiscal year starts in October so productivity penalties could happen.  The facility leadership has to answer to the regional network if any department is below 25th percentile for productivity.  

              I suspect when a rad is hired, the department productivity goal goes up accordingly. If a rad takes way above average time off and sick days, will the department productivity goals be adjusted down?

              • rgiles912_432

                Member
                August 15, 2023 at 6:14 am

                Quote from DrBoogie

                I suspect when a rad is hired, the department productivity goal goes up accordingly. If a rad takes way above average time off and sick days, will the department productivity goals be adjusted down?

                In my experience at two facilities over 17 years, adding a new Rad helped to ease the understaffing and also prevented some films from having to be sent out to Fee Basis or NTP readers.  The individual RVU targets have increased since the 2000’s at a low of 500RVU to current numbers listed above for FY2023.  Seems like my chief’s have always wanted to increase departmental productivity.  
                With regard to usage of time off, all providers get 26 annual leave days, 13 sick leave days and 5 meeting days.  In my first facility we were all encouraged to use up all of our 26 annual leave days, these were chosen through a lottery system every year to assign vacation days; if you didn’t claim a day, finding someone to switch with was hard.  Sick leave was used more variably but no one was ever penalized for using all 13 days in a year.  Once you used up all your allotment and missed a work day, it was considered leave without pay. That did seem to have HR repercussions. 
                 

                • alex.nieto_484

                  Member
                  August 15, 2023 at 6:25 am

                  500 RVU!?!? Are you missing a 0?

                  • rgiles912_432

                    Member
                    August 15, 2023 at 6:32 am

                    Quote from RadCog

                    500 RVU!?!? Are you missing a 0?

                     Yes, 5000 was the number when I first joined VA. 

                  • rgiles912_432

                    Member
                    August 15, 2023 at 6:38 am

                    Quote from RadCog

                    500 RVU!?!? Are you missing a 0?

                     Yes, 5000 was the number when I first joined VA. 

    • kellybyers123_914

      Member
      August 15, 2023 at 10:27 am

      Quote from RadCog

      Quote from randomrad

      Serious answer from a VA rad: volumes are up 60-80% since 2013, depending on modality.  Increasing reliance on in-house imaging (instead of “community care”) for PET, MR, LDCT for LCS, and pain intervention will result in an additional 40-50% increase over the next 2 years.  VA National mandates, market competition, and demographic changes have put some of our radiology departments in tough circumstances for near-term staffing.  I’m worried about a “critical mass” of increasing workload beyond the expected VA standards leading to short order retirement of multiple VA rads.  Also, I’m told that NTP is not currently taking new business, so there is no internal safety net to account for personnel losses in the near-term.  To be clear, VA radiology has a lot of regional and local variability in workload and staffing, so these trends may not be universal.  

      Do you have any source for this information? 

      If the VA RVU goal is 5.5k rads aren’t going to start cranking out 13k because of staffing shortages. That isn’t how the incentives for the VA work and rads who like to read efficiently don’t generally join the VA.

       
      Source:  We run these numbers monthly.  These are for one facility only, so it may not be a universal trend, as I mentioned. 
       
      Re: the work having to get done, you are correct.  The rads will only do so much, and there is definitely a sense among the rads of commensurate performance for pay (rather than the other way around, unfortunately).  We have evening moonlighters who clean up some of the ouptatient studies, and we contract with academia for certain subspecialty reads to offload the generalists.  We’ve hired 2 additional rads in the last few years, but recruiting is very difficult recently.  Easier to get fee-basis rads, but even that is difficult recently.  
       
      Any ordering volume not accommodated locally within VA gets done in the community and paid for by the VA.  This is triggered automatically once we are scheduling out past 30 days.  So ultimately the work will get done, as you mentioned, just maybe not in-house.  Its a real management challenge, I’m sure you can imagine.  
       
      One point I would disagree on though, there are a minority of VA rads who will work harder to meet the volume challenges, and end up taking a larger share of this volume penalty out of a service-oriented mindset.  Frame that however you want.  
       
       

      • alex.nieto_484

        Member
        August 15, 2023 at 10:43 am

        Quote from randomrad

        Quote from RadCog

        Quote from randomrad

        Serious answer from a VA rad: volumes are up 60-80% since 2013, depending on modality.  Increasing reliance on in-house imaging (instead of “community care”) for PET, MR, LDCT for LCS, and pain intervention will result in an additional 40-50% increase over the next 2 years.  VA National mandates, market competition, and demographic changes have put some of our radiology departments in tough circumstances for near-term staffing.  I’m worried about a “critical mass” of increasing workload beyond the expected VA standards leading to short order retirement of multiple VA rads.  Also, I’m told that NTP is not currently taking new business, so there is no internal safety net to account for personnel losses in the near-term.  To be clear, VA radiology has a lot of regional and local variability in workload and staffing, so these trends may not be universal.  

        Do you have any source for this information? 

        If the VA RVU goal is 5.5k rads aren’t going to start cranking out 13k because of staffing shortages. That isn’t how the incentives for the VA work and rads who like to read efficiently don’t generally join the VA.

        Source:  We run these numbers monthly.  These are for one facility only, so it may not be a universal trend, as I mentioned. 

        Re: the work having to get done, you are correct.  The rads will only do so much, and there is definitely a sense among the rads of commensurate performance for pay (rather than the other way around, unfortunately).  We have evening moonlighters who clean up some of the ouptatient studies, and we contract with academia for certain subspecialty reads to offload the generalists.  We’ve hired 2 additional rads in the last few years, but recruiting is very difficult recently.  Easier to get fee-basis rads, but even that is difficult recently.  

        Any ordering volume not accommodated locally within VA gets done in the community and paid for by the VA.  This is triggered automatically once we are scheduling out past 30 days.  So ultimately the work will get done, as you mentioned, just maybe not in-house.  Its a real management challenge, I’m sure you can imagine.  

        One point I would disagree on though, there are a minority of VA rads who will work harder to meet the volume challenges, and end up taking a larger share of this volume penalty out of a service-oriented mindset.  Frame that however you want.  

         
        I hope to one day meet this mythical creature you speak of

  • y.rajshekar

    Member
    August 15, 2023 at 6:23 am

    I dont use my sick days much as we are understaffed most of the weeks and I dont want to make coworkers scramble to cover for me. Not sure how to approach it as I already accrued a lot of sick time.

    • rgiles912_432

      Member
      August 15, 2023 at 6:31 am

      You and me, both.  The old-timer Rads who started back in the 1980’s and early 90’s told me to use up all my sick time.  I never felt right doing that-more than a 1000 hours in the sick leave bank.  

      • alex.nieto_484

        Member
        August 15, 2023 at 6:41 am

        Quote from Osseon

        You and me, both.  The old-timer Rads who started back in the 1980’s and early 90’s told me to use up all my sick time.  I never felt right doing that-more than a 1000 hours in the sick leave bank.  

         
        When you retire they pay those out I think. So that will be pretty nice. They will cut you a check for like 200k.
         
        I was at the VA for 2 years and never used any of my sick time either. We had 1 rad who took a job as an employee at a local hospital right when COVID hit and they put in their 3 month notice then called in sick everyday until their last day when they came in and worked half a day turned in their badge and left. 

        • y.rajshekar

          Member
          August 15, 2023 at 6:48 am

          One old rad calculated that you get pennies on the dollar when you cash in your sick days at retirement. So the guy who actually called in sick got full pay.

        • Donpacini77_632

          Member
          August 16, 2023 at 1:12 pm

          Annual Leave is paid at full rate (base pay plus market pay). 
          Sick Leave is paid only on base pay.
           
          When I retire, my plan is to have a zero sick leave balance.  Probably the same with annual leave.  Why not use all the leave you’ve earned?  If you need the $$, go moonlight for a few weeks as that will more than make up for any cash the VA will pay you.

  • g.giancaspro_108

    Member
    August 16, 2023 at 3:34 pm

    Our local VA reached out to a rad they know here, that they’ve spoken with before, and said that they can pay above the cap and ‘ask for what you want’.  That’s all I know, I don’t think the rad responded yet.
     

    • buckeyeguy

      Member
      August 19, 2023 at 7:41 pm

      Where are the no-go locations?
      Also, I was wondering, could you do tele for a particular site from overseas? Why not, it’s not CMS … hehe

      • y.rajshekar

        Member
        August 19, 2023 at 9:53 pm

        Quote from Dream Run

        Where are the no-go locations?
        Also, I was wondering, could you do tele for a particular site from overseas? Why not, it’s not CMS … hehe

         
        One of medicine docs got caught accessing charts from overseas. VA thought it was a big deal and sent a memo. Security reasons. 

        • buckeyeguy

          Member
          August 20, 2023 at 9:35 am

          Quote from DrBoogie

          Quote from Dream Run

          Where are the no-go locations?
          Also, I was wondering, could you do tele for a particular site from overseas? Why not, it’s not CMS … hehe

          One of medicine docs got caught accessing charts from overseas. VA thought it was a big deal and sent a memo. Security reasons. 

           
          Darn. I was hoping that the increased demand would maybe create a scenario for readers to be accommodated.

  • bwevanslds

    Member
    September 19, 2023 at 10:51 am

    ..

  • fabraddad

    Member
    October 5, 2023 at 5:32 pm

    I can cofirm at least 6 different va’s offering near max salary and 25% per year x4 year incentives. I can also confirm at least one chief position is offering 50% incentives.

    • economd2

      Member
      October 8, 2023 at 12:34 am

      Can you elaborate on the exact offfer amount? Incentives disappear after 2 years?

  • fabraddad

    Member
    October 5, 2023 at 5:33 pm

    also, this change on forums is an epic downgrade

  • fabraddad

    Member
    October 5, 2023 at 5:38 pm

    I can now confirm at least one VA is offering 50% incentive for staff.

  • fabraddad

    Member
    October 7, 2023 at 6:57 pm

    I am not anti aunt minnie so I think it would be unnecessarily defensive and self destructive if they edited out my last comment looking for a place where Aunt Minnie used to help with but now seems to be less used since the update.

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