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Trump defends Russian invasion of Afghanistan on same day Putin rewrites history
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I just finished listening to John Bolton on a live interview on Bloomberg radio.
He was asked point blank whether he briefed Trump on the Russian bounty for troop murder.
Formal response: No comment…. but really yes
he says he cant comment because he is involved in litigation over classification.
then he goes on to specifically cite Susan Rice opinion piece
[link=https://www.nytimes.com/2020/06/30/opinion/trump-russia-afghanistan.html]https://www.nytimes.com/2…ussia-afghanistan.html[/link]
where she says that when she was the DNI if she had heard the same information she would have promptly gone directly to the president to inform him of it.
Bolton then says I agree with Susan Rice
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Quote from dergon
[link=https://www.politico.com/news/2020/06/30/pompeo-taliban-americans-afghanistan-345722]https://www.politico.com/news/2020/06/30/pompeo-taliban-americans-afghanistan-345722[/link]
Pompeo calls Taliban to remind them not to attack Americans …. but, you know, the story is still fake news.
I know they’re trying to do a peace deal with the government and the Taliban. All reporting says the Taliban is basically doing their same old schtick. Oppressing the people, girls cannot go to school etc…
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[link=https://news.yahoo.com/trump-admin-mulls-keeping-putin-230250268.html?ncid=twitter_yahoonewst_sjwumo1bpf4]https://news.yahoo.com/trump-admin-mulls-keeping-putin-230250268.html?ncid=twitter_yahoonewst_sjwumo1bpf4
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[h1][b]Trump Admin Mulls Keeping Putin From G7 Summit in Response to Russian Bounties on Americans Heads[/b][/h1]“You know that thing that you weren’t supposed to be invited to because you got kicked out of it for doing a bunch of bad stuff but that I wanted to invite you to against the wishes of all my other allies and that Merkel already said she wouldn’t come to if you showed up? Yeah … I might un-invite you that thing. Seems like a pretty fair trade for you having a bunch of our soldiers killed.”
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Thats lame. I would go after personal finances of Putin and lock down our size any assets we can.
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[link=https://thehill.com/policy/international/505845-us-pushes-ahead-with-taliban-peace-deal-despite-reported-involvement-in]US pushes ahead with Taliban peace deal despite reported involvement in carrying out bounties on US troops[/link]
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Is this story over? I couldnt find any updates.
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Is this story over? I couldnt find any updates.
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What… do you think it’s like an episode of Law & Order where the entire thing is settled in a nice tidy 1 hour broadcast?
What would you expect to have happened in the intervening 3 days of the 4th of July holiday to move this story forward?
The only thing that is going to get to the bottom of this is testimony under oath and release of documents/ communications from the White House.
So it will likely be dribs and drabs of leaks and journalists chasing leads etc while McEnany attacks the press and lies and misdirects to some other topic …
… because the White House isn’t going to release the PDB and Trump isn’t going to send his DNI and others from his national security team down to publicly testify on it in front of the house in open session.
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I’m curious too. Seems this happens way too often. We never get to see the end. It’s like they setup for a movie and stop half way.
It’s like watching Speed, the bomb is triggered on the bus. But they shut the show half way… so presumably it blew up?
Or Jurassic park… we’re left assuming the tour ends happily. Did Malcolm and Dr.Grant endorse the park?
The news just stops reporting so everybody assumes it happened…
At least we know better now and stick around to see the ending.
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See post #87
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When does the story finish?
I don’t place the onus on you to finish the story.
I do however ask you to reconsider your obidient surrender to the news.
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Btw, this is not what happens when they have something substantive against Trump. They dig and dig and dig and then start conjuring up stuff.
They nevwr just go silent like this. hiatus it’s not.
This story looks to be dead. Sorry.
FAKE NEWS
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Btw, this is not what happens when they have something substantive against Trump. They dig and dig and dig and then start conjuring up stuff.
They never just go silent like this. Hiatus this ain’t
This story looks to be dead. Sorry.
FAKE NEWS
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Btw, this is not what happens when they think they have something substantive against Trump. They dig and dig and dig and then start conjuring up stuff.
They never just go silent like this. Hiatus this ain’t
This story looks to be dead. Sorry.
FAKE NEWS
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As long as the GOP keeps covering for him hes good to keep on reaching his new lows.
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[h1]Trump Pushed CIA to Give Intelligence to Kremlin, While Taking No Action Against Russia Arming Taliban[/h1]
[link=https://www.justsecurity.org/71279/trump-pushed-cia-to-give-intelligence-to-kremlin-while-taking-no-action-against-russia-arming-taliban/]https://www.justsecurity.org/71279/t…rming-taliban/[/link]
Why would the Russian government think it could get away with paying bounties to the Taliban to kill American soldiers? One answer to that question may be the extraordinary response that Moscow received when the Trump administration learned of a precursor to the bounty operation. From mid-2017 and into 2018, Pentagon officials became increasingly confident in intelligence reports that the Kremlin was arming the Taliban, which posed a significant threat to American and coalition forces on the ground in Afghanistan.
President Trumps actions in the face of the Russia-Taliban arms program likely signaled weak US resolve in the eyes of Putin and Russian military intelligence.
Three dimensions of Trumps response are described in detail in this article, based on interviews with several former Trump administration officials who spoke to [i]Just Security[/i] on the record.First, President Trump decided not to confront Putin about supplying arms to the terrorist group. Second, during the very times in which U.S. military officials publicly raised concerns about the programs threat to U.S. forces, Trump undercut them. He embraced Putin, overtly and repeatedly, including at the historic summit in Helsinki.
Third, behind the scenes, Trump directed the CIA to share intelligence information on counterterrorism with the Kremlin despite no discernible reward, former intelligence officials who served in the Trump administration told [i]Just Security[/i]. -
Quote from DICOM_Dan
As long as the GOP keeps covering for him hes good to keep on reaching his new lows.
Yep.
[link=https://www.politico.com/news/2020/07/07/congress-russian-bounty-afghanistan-350915]https://www.politico.com/news/2020/07/07/congress-russian-bounty-afghanistan-350915[/link]
[b]Lawmakers paralyzed over response to Russian bounty intel[/b][/h2]
The stalemate underscores the difficulties lawmakers face in confronting an increasingly emboldened Russia especially in an election year, when Republicans are unlikely to publicly break with the president, who has sought to maintain a good relationship with Russian President Vladimir Putin even as he continues to alarm some in the GOP with his deferential posture toward the Russian leader.
Im interested in hearing an administration speak clearly about their plans that arent just hypothetical sanctions sometime out in the future, but what should we be doing now to make the GRU have more doubts about their behavior not just in Afghanistan, but more broadly across the globe, said Sen. Ben Sasse (R-Neb.), an outspoken Russia hawk who sits on the Intelligence panel.
The U.S. intelligence community broadly agrees that Russias military intelligence unit has been providing financial support to the Taliban to help fund Taliban operations that have killed coalition troops in Afghanistan. But a central dispute outlined in a memo written by recently confirmed Director of National Intelligence John Ratcliffe earlier this month remains over the Russians motives.
While the CIA and National Counterterrorism Center have assessed with medium confidence that the GRU has paid bounties to Taliban fighters specifically to kill U.S. soldiers and that the operation has resulted in fatalities other agencies have expressed low confidence in that assessment, stemming from difficulties tying specific payments to certain attacks, according to people who have seen the memo.
Whereas the CIA has confidence in its human sources and interrogations conducted on the ground, the National Security Agency relies more on surveillance and signals intelligence to make assessments, and remains uncertain about whether certain payments constitute bounties or whether they are just part of the broader pattern of Russian funding for Taliban operations that ultimately kill coalition troops.[b]
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Sen. Tammy Duckworth (D-Illinois) … said that of the five bounty-related intelligence documents she had read in a secure Capitol facility, none backed up the White House claims that the assessments were too uncorroborated to disclose to the president.
The documents I read are consistent with whats been reported so far, she told reporters. As far as I can tell, whats out there is accurate.-
Would have been a great opportunity for the Trump WHite House to clarify:
[link=https://www.nydailynews.com/news/politics/ny-trump-russian-bounty-scandal-putin-20200723-hvw2uee7tvg6dc33lvfsbp2tji-story.html]https://www.nydailynews.com/news/politics/ny-trump-russian-bounty-scandal-putin-20200723-hvw2uee7tvg6dc33lvfsbp2tji-story.html[/link]
[b]Trump doesnt bring up Russian bounty scandal on call with Putin[/b][/h1]President Trump jumped on the phone with Vladimir Putin on Thursday, but apparently didnt ask the Russian leader about the Kremlins alleged plots to kill American soldiers, steal U.S. research on coronavirus vaccines and interfere in Novembers election.
Trump, whos been accused by critics of being too soft on Russia, discussed arms control, efforts to defeat the coronavirus pandemic and other bilateral and global issues in the chat with Putin, according to a readout from White House spokesman Judd Deere.
An unsigned readout from the Kremlin echoed Deeres statement and added that the situation around the Iranian nuclear program was also touched upon.
Absent from both statements were any mention of U.S. intelligence assessments that Russias military intelligence service has allegedly been offering cash bounties to Taliban fighters willing to kill American service members in Afghanistan.
Even though the intelligence findings first came to light on June 26, Trump has yet to comment on them besides thumbing out a handful of tweets calling the damning assessments part of a hoax made up by Democrats.
Putin has vociferously denied the allegations, but the intel was credible enough for White House national security adviser Robert OBrien to say earlier this month that the U.S. prepared retaliatory options against Moscow.
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[b]Belgian Intelligence knew of Bounty Program[/b]
The information was revealed by Belgiums defence minister Philippe Goffin who is also minister for foreign affairs. Goffin was replying to a parliamentary question from MP Samuel Cogolati.
The SGRS is aware of general Russian support for the Taliban in Afghanistan and confirms a possible Russian interference, Goffin said.
According to information available to us from open sources, only one incident could be linked to the bounty program, most notably [link=https://www.nytimes.com/2020/07/14/us/politics/afghanistan-russia-bounties-marines.html][u]the car-[/u][u]bomb[/u][u] attack[/u][/link] on an American convoy in early April 2019. In that attack, three American soldiers lost their lives, he said.
Belgium was part of a Nato joint force in Afghanistan until earlier this year, but the troops have now returned home after a one-month delay caused by the coronavirus crisis here.
[link=https://www.brusselstimes.com/all-news/belgium-all-news/121903/belgian-intelligence-knew-of-russian-bounties-on-troops-in-afghanistan/]https://www.brusselstimes.com/all-news/belgium-all-news/121903/belgian-intelligence-knew-of-russian-bounties-on-troops-in-afghanistan/[/link]
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Trump asked today point blank whether he brought up the bounty program during his recent call with Putin.
“We don’t discuss” what happens on those calls.-
[link]https://youtu.be/0HzB2tAUd64[/link]
This interview with Trump is quite telling. He admits he didn’t confront Putin about Russia paying the Taliban to kill U.S. troops. He has spoken with Putin 8 times since he was first briefed… never mentioned it.-
Sen. Menendez: “Have you raised that issue [of bounties] with Foreign Minister Lavrov?”
Pompeo: “…Proper people have been aware to every single threat to our soldiers on the ground in Afghanistan.”
[link=https://twitter.com/thehill/status/1288878269429776385]https://twitter.com/thehill/status/1288878269429776385[/link]-
Iran Also Paid Bounties to Taliban for Targeting U.S. Troops[/h1]
US intelligence agencies assessed that Iran offered bounties to Taliban fighters for targeting American and coalition troops in Afghanistan, identifying payments linked to at least six attacks carried out by the militant group just last year alone, including a suicide bombing at a US air base in December, [link=https://www.cnn.com/2020/08/17/politics/iran-taliban-bounties-us-intelligence/index.html]CNN[/link] reports.
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Prediction: *Now* the Trump administration decides to get serious about addressing bounties but continues to ignore the Russian/Putin side of it. … And then tries to claim that they have been serious about protecting our troops from [b]bad Iran [/b] the whole time.-
[h1]Esper Warned About Pulling Troops from Afghanistan …. Trump pushes forward with withdrawal [/h1]
Then-Secretary of Defense Mark Esper sent a classified memo earlier this month to the White House asserting that it was the [b]unanimous recommendation of the chain of command[/b] that the US not draw down its troop presence in Afghanistan any further until conditions were met, [link=https://www.cnn.com/2020/11/16/politics/esper-memo-troop-withdrawal/index.html]CNN[/link] reports.
The assessment from the chain of command Esper, US Central Command leader Marine Gen. Kenneth Frank McKenzie and commander of NATOs mission in Afghanistan Gen. Austin Miller stated that the necessary conditions had not been met. Others agreed, sources tell CNN, including Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff Gen. Mark Milley.
The memo is believed to have been one of the main reasons why outgoing President Trump fired Esper last week.
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[link=https://www.politico.com/news/2021/03/01/tammy-duckworth-biden-russian-bounties-471931]Duckworth urges Biden admin to release intel on Russian bounties
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“While any intelligence assessment on this matter is understandably sensitive, the American public, and Gold Star Families in particular, have a pressing need to know if there is any truth to these claims,” Duckworth wrote. “I believe such a finding may be presented while protecting classified information.”
The allegations that the Russian military intelligence service, the GRU, offered bounties to Taliban-linked militants to target U.S. and coalition forces in Afghanistan was first reported by The New York Times in June.
Then-President Donald Trump initially called the report a “hoax.” He said intelligence officials told him he was not briefed about those allegations at the time because [link=https://www.npr.org/2020/06/28/884407572/trump-denies-briefing-on-russian-bounties-reportedly-placed-on-u-s-troops]they did not find them credible[/link]. Gen. Frank McKenzie, head of U.S. Central Command, [link=https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/national-security/u-s-commander-intel-still-hasn-t-established-russia-paid-n1240020]said in September[/link] the intel still hadn’t been corroborated.
In the March 1 letter, Duckworth pointed to public reports showing possible evidence that GRU bounty offers had been made, may have resulted in payments and may have “inspired or incentivized” deadly attacks against U.S. and coalition forces.
[/QUOTE]
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It would be good if we could push this into the Russian public’s view also.
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[b]Biden Seems Ready to Extend Troops In Afghanistan[/b][/h1]
Without coming right out and saying it, President Joe Biden seems ready to let lapse a May 1 deadline for completing a withdrawal of U.S. troops from Afghanistan. Orderly withdrawals take time, and Biden is running out of it, the [link=https://www.pbs.org/newshour/politics/biden-seems-ready-to-extend-u-s-troop-presence-in-afghanistan]AP[/link] reports.
Biden has inched so close to the deadline that his indecision amounts almost to a decision to put off, at least for a number of months, a pullout of the remaining 2,500 troops and continue supporting the Afghan military at the risk of a Taliban backlash. Removing all of the troops and their equipment in the next three weeks along with coalition partners that cannot get out on their own would be difficult logistically, as Biden himself suggested in late March.
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[b]Biden to Withdraw All Troops from Afghanistan[/b][/h1]
President Biden will withdraw all American troops from Afghanistan over the coming months, people familiar with the plans said, completing the military exit by the 20th anniversary of the Sept. 11, 2001, attacks that first drew the United States into its longest war, the [link=https://www.washingtonpost.com/national-security/biden-us-troop-withdrawal-afghanistan/2021/04/13/918c3cae-9beb-11eb-8a83-3bc1fa69c2e8_story.html]Washington Post[/link] reports.-
I was listening to a good podcast about Taliban and Afghan government. As soon as we pull out the Taliban is gonna run over them. The only thing I can think is Biden can say dont make us come back.
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I’m trying hard to remember the Podcast I listened to when someone was reporting about the Taliban and Afghan talks going on. It was in Qatar at some resort. It was interesting to hear about how these hard ons went to a nice resort and had to be around people being normal. Girls in bathing suits etc..
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[b]How Bidens Team Overrode the Brass on Afghanistan[/b][/h1]
[link=https://www.politico.com/news/2021/04/14/pentagon-biden-team-overrode-afghanistan-481556]Politico[/link]: As Biden weighed a full exit from the country this spring, top military leaders advocated for keeping a small U.S. presence on the ground made up primarily of special operations forces and paramilitary advisers, arguing that a force of a few thousand troops was needed to keep the Taliban in check and prevent Afghanistan from once again becoming a haven for terrorists, according to nine former and current U.S. officials familiar with the discussions.
But in the end, Biden and his top national security deputies did what no previous president has done successfully they overrode the brass. [It] is Secretary of State Antony Blinken and national security adviser Jake Sullivan who are truly running the Pentagon, according to two former officials familiar with the discussions.-
Trump got the ball rolling on this one. I think he signed off that we’d be out of there 15 days ago. There were expectations that as soon as that didn’t happen the Taliban would re-engage in fighting. I’ve not seen much news about what’s going on over there, or in the middle east either.
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Quote from DICOM_Dan
Trump got the ball rolling on this one. I think he signed off that we’d be out of there 15 days ago. There were expectations that as soon as that didn’t happen the Taliban would re-engage in fighting. I’ve not seen much news about what’s going on over there, or in the middle east either.
Agree. This is place where Trump deserves credit. I didn’t like a lot of his foreign policy, but his anti-intervention stance was pretty consistent.
He also did a huge political favor to Biden is shifting attitudes in the Republican base to favor withdrawal. If any previous Democrat had tried to pull out, the GOP hawks and right-wing media would be screaming that they were making America weak against terror …. now it’s pretty much just Lindsey Graham doing that.
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To think in 2001 the Taliban offered to hand over Bin Laden if Bush provided proof he did and we stopped bombing. Bush rebuffed the offer.
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Quote from DICOM_Dan
Trump got the ball rolling on this one. I think he signed off that we’d be out of there 15 days ago. There were expectations that as soon as that didn’t happen the Taliban would re-engage in fighting. I’ve not seen much news about what’s going on over there, or in the middle east either.
As for the Taliban and re-engaging in fighting, my prediction is that Afghanistan probably descends into much worse conflict, perhaps a civil war.
You have a generation of young Afghanis sitting in cafes in downtown Kabul modelling european behavior who are going to be none-too-happy when a bunch of fundys come in and try to put them on sharia lockdown again.
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Its under reported by I had saw something about targeted killings of the type of people you mention. Thats being done by the Taliban. From reporters, to strong women, to business people. Any non-stone age thinkers are on the hit list.
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[b]Pulling Troops Out of Afghanistan Is Very Popular[/b][/h1]
A new [link=https://drive.google.com/file/d/1pv_2HXp1J11BuQneMXzwc31AmfmIqKx9/view]CBS/YouGov poll[/link] suggests big public support for President Bidens decision to withdraw military forces from Afghanistan, with 77% supporting the move.
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[link=https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/national-security/remember-those-russian-bounties-dead-u-s-troops-biden-admin-n1264215]https://www.nbcnews.com/p…s-biden-admin-n1264215[/link]
[b]Biden admin says the CIA intel is not conclusive on Russian bounties for dead U.S. troops [/b]
The White House fact sheet explaining new sanctions over Russian misbehavior made clear that Russia was not being sanctioned over the issue. It used careful language, referring to “reported Afghanistan bounties.”
“The administration is responding to the reports that Russia encouraged Taliban attacks against U.S. and coalition personnel in Afghanistan based on the best assessments from the Intelligence Community,” the fact sheet says. “Given the sensitivity of this matter, which involves the safety and well-being of our forces, it is being handled through diplomatic, military and intelligence channels.”
In intelligence parlance, moderate confidence means the information is plausible and credibly sourced, but not quite corroborated enough to merit a higher rating.
Low confidence means the analysis was based on questionable or implausible information or information too fragmented or poorly corroborated to make solid inferences. It can also reflect problems with the credibility of the sources.
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Military officials say they have looked hard but found no other evidence to corroborate that such a program existed.
Gen. Frank McKenzie, commander of the U.S. Central Command, whose remit includes Afghanistan, told NBC News, “It just has not been proved to a level of certainty that satisfies me.”
“We continue to look for that evidence,” the general added. “I just haven’t seen it yet. But it’s not a closed issue.”
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Defense Secretary Mark Esper told the House Armed Services Committee in July that “All the defense intelligence agencies have been unable to corroborate that report. “That has not changed, a senior official with direct knowledge told NBC News Thursday. -
[b]Pentagon Accelerates Afghanistan Pullout[/b][/h1]
[link=https://www.nytimes.com/2021/05/25/us/politics/us-afghanistan-withdrawal.html]New York Times[/link]: United States troops and their NATO allies intend to be out of Afghanistan by early to mid-July, well ahead of President Bidens Sept. 11 withdrawal deadline, military officials said, in what has turned into an accelerated ending to Americas longest war.-
you’d think this is delayed withdrawal. I don’t recall seeing any update to the agreement Trump made to pull out by 3/31
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Quote from DICOM_Dan
you’d think this is delayed withdrawal. I don’t recall seeing any update to the agreement Trump made to pull out by 3/31
Trump never actually ordered the full withdrawal. He cut troops numbers and *talked* about a withdrawal.. but never went all the way through.
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Taliban Seizes Key District[/h1]
Taliban fighters took control of a key district in Afghanistans northern Kunduz province Monday and encircled the provincial capital, police said, as the insurgent group added to its recent battlefield victories while peace talks have stalemated, the [link=https://apnews.com/article/joe-biden-taliban-2b1f92ab572a905521fab2644922c307]Associated Press[/link] reports.
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My best guess was civil war after pull out. I thought we would be in a situation where the Afghan President was really just the mayor of Kabul and the Taliban held everything else.
But even the capitol gone.
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I was in favor of pulling out under Trump. Still in favor now.. mostly because the alternative was perpetuity.
(Although politically now I wish Trump would have followed through faster and eaten the sh*tburger instead )
But its sure ugly.
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After 20 years of training and building an Afghan military and police force who turned tail at the 1st opportunity without firing a shot in very many cases and propping up a government that Afghans did not support and who did not support their own military and police, about time it ended. Establishing a Western-style democracy in a country with no tradition of democracy is a bit of lost-in-translation effort. The Afghanistan Papers verify all that was wrong with the support with rampant corruption going on.
When Afghanis are asking who is worse, the Afghani police or the Taliban, all you have is a sh1t-show for all of our investment.
We have learned nothing from our Vietnam adventure.-
Im old enough to remember when Ted Cruz was eviscerated by the media for going on vacation during an ice storm he had nothing to do with. Where is Joe? Where is Kamala? Where is Psaki?
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We should have pulled out of there. If they want a civil war then let them. There are governments just as bad as the Taliban in multiple other countries.
We wasted 20 years for sure.
The only bad things here are the poor messaging/communication from the WH and the rapid, poorly-thought-out nature of the withdrawal. I have no beef with getting out of there.
Whomever was President was going to get hammered over this when it happened. Very poor form to take a vacation and not taking questions though during the process. Although I think everyone pretty clearly knows Biden’s mind is lost at sea. Maybe not Feinstein level yet but soon.-
Poorly thought out or utter surprise of the swift fleeing without a shot by Afghan military. Just last week it was assumed that the Taliban takeover to Kabul would take a few weeks at least.
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Quote from Frumious
Poorly thought out or utter surprise of the swift fleeing without a shot by Afghan military. Just last week it was assumed that the Taliban takeover to Kabul would take a few weeks at least.
For sure there was an intel failure of huge proportion here.
Lots worse than anticipated.-
Our problem since 2001, poor intel to extreme misreading and interpretation of intel.
Good thing we have Iraq to call a success.
Oh, wait!
Bush & Cheney & neo-cons botched it all up from GO which became the operating principle. Yes, Trump did not have the nerve to pull out and accepted the Pentagon’s analysis. Biden might look bad since he’s the one where the buck stops but he rejected the Pentagon’s continuing analysis that we have to stay. I give him credit for not continuing a mistaken & failed policy & passing it on to his successor.-
[link=https://www.politico.com/news/magazine/2021/08/16/afghanistan-history-taliban-collapse-504977]https://www.politico.com/…aliban-collapse-504977[/link]
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Quote from dergon
Quote from Frumious
Poorly thought out or utter surprise of the swift fleeing without a shot by Afghan military. Just last week it was assumed that the Taliban takeover to Kabul would take a few weeks at least.
For sure there was an intel failure of huge proportion here.
Lots worse than anticipated.
The Taliban had been taking the afghan army outposts for the past year. The central government had stopped paying their soldiers and the US had stopped providing air support. The Taliban would send in a tribal elder who explained the alternatives to the soldiers:
A. You give up, leave behind anything but your AK and we give you safe passage to your village and some pocket money.
B. You dont give up and we kill you, rape your wife and then kill all your children.
You pick.
For the most part, they apparently held up their end of the deal on both ends. The afghan soldiers knew this.
Anyone in the US military who ever interacted with the afghan national army knew that they were worthless and would fold the moment they lost US backing. This is the expected outcome.-
We knew that when we hired those Afghani mercenaries in 2001. We were the highest bidder.
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videos of people trying to cling onto globe master AirForce jets as they cruise down the tarmac. Supposedly 7 killed. Desperate times.
The taliban has been systematically assassinating Afghan leaders and journos for a little while now too. -
Quote from DICOM_Dan
videos of people trying to cling onto globe master AirForce jets as they cruise down the tarmac. Supposedly 7 killed. Desperate times.
[image]https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/9/95/Saigon-hubert-van-es.jpg[/image]
[size=”2″](photograph of the CIA building evacuation by Hubert van Es, dutch photographer) [/size]
Richard Nixon gave us the EPA. I wonder what we’ll remember Biden for. -
Anyone in the US military who ever interacted with the afghan national army knew that they were worthless and would fold the moment they lost US backing. This is the expected outcome.
Sadly this is true
I spent 8 months there and I can say yes this is true
The feeling was they wanted us to do everything for them. They hadnt bought into our vision for them
Perhaps that can finally be the lesson
If they dont buy into our vision for them maybe we should question our involvement sooner
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+1
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It’s like a clown car of responses from the right. Impeach Biden because he used a teleprompter. Biden hid at camp david.
Like WTF would Trump be doing. He’d be golfing or bunker boying. -
Quote from DICOM_Dan
It’s like a clown car of responses from the right. Impeach Biden because he used a teleprompter. Biden hid at camp david.
Like WTF would Trump be doing. He’d be golfing or bunker boying.
So Biden’s defense is “Well, Trump might have done something worse!”
Solid. -
Did any of you guys ever serve?
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I was there for a little over 8 months
Honestly this is not a surprising outcome
Bush Obama trump are all responsible
Biden has been in office 7 months
He was given 2000 troops on the ground when he took office and a prior administration that wouldnt communicate with him
Did Biden well? No he didnt
But blood is on all of their hands
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I was there for a little over 8 months
Honestly this is not a surprising outcome
Bush Obama trump are all responsible
Biden has been in office 7 months
He was given 2000 troops on the ground when he took office and a prior administration that wouldnt communicate with him
Did Biden well? No he didnt
But blood is on all of their hands
But if you want to go back and fix things
By all means go
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Ive not served but have lost a friend who served there. Not to combat but to burn pits.
Pretty good listen today. The Stand Up with Pete podcast. He had Mathew Hoh on. He was the civilian rep for the state department. Interesting to hear his insider takes. About the culture etc. Worth a listen if you got a half hour in the car
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Can you post a link
Id be interested
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Biden state department demands that the Taliban must form an inclusive government that includes the full participation of women.
[link=https://twitter.com/mattwalshblog/status/1427389269170180109?s=21]https://twitter.com/mattw…27389269170180109?s=21[/link]
You think these savages give a F?
Leftists, folks. I mean, I cant even.
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Quote from Chirorad84
Can you post a link
Id be interested
In Chrome I typed “stand up with pete dominick” and about the third thing is shows is the recent podcast. If you click the one that starts “Marine Veteran and former State Department….” is goes to the Mathew Hoh. It starts at 30 minutes into the pod. He usually talks news and stuff before he interviews. I enjoy his podcast though. He get’s some good guest and is usually a good listen.
This is the URL google took me to.
[link=https://podcasts.google.com/feed/aHR0cHM6Ly9zdGFuZHVwd2l0aHBldGUubGlic3luLmNvbS9yc3M/episode/MWVjYTY4ODctZWQwYi00NjAwLWJmMWUtNWEzZWYxYzhkZjcz?hl=en&ved=2ahUKEwjlrpPokLjyAhXMXc0KHfjDCzEQieUEegQIDxAF&ep=6]https://podcasts.google.c…QieUEegQIDxAF&ep=6[/link] -
Thanks
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this was all too foreseeable. Good thing we’ve been there for 20 years training Afghan security forces. They might as well be straw men. 20 years for next to nothing. The damn Pakistanis were hiding Bin Laden, who’s niece was spotted on a boat at the Biden summit holding a Trump flag.
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Like Vietnam, after years of propping up the government, if the people themselves don’t support the government, why are we?
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I don’t disagree with that but lots of lost blood and treasure from the US and our allies. The country will fall to the Taliban post haste.
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As did Vietnam fall to the NVA.
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[link=https://www.nytimes.com/2021/07/31/world/asia/afghanistan-migration-taliban.html?action=click&module=In%20Other%20News&pgtype=Homepage]New York Times[/link]
[b]As Fears Grip Afghanistan, Hundreds of Thousands Flee[/b]
So far this year around 330,000 Afghans have been displaced, more than half of them fleeing their homes since the United States began its withdrawal in May, according to the United Nations.
Many have flooded into makeshift tent camps or crowded into relatives homes in cities, the last islands of government control in many provinces. Thousands more are trying to secure passports and visas to leave the country altogether. Others have crammed into smugglers pickup trucks in a desperate bid to slip illegally over the border.
In recent weeks, the number of Afghans crossing the border illegally shot up around 30 to 40 percent compared to the period before international troops began withdrawing in May, according to the International Organization for Migration. At least 30,000 people are now fleeing every week.
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[b]U.S. Citizens Told to Leave Afghanistan Immediately[/b]
[b]
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The U.S. embassy in Afghanistan [link=https://af.usembassy.gov/security-alert-u-s-embassy-kabul-afghanistan-august-7-2021/]urged U.S. citizens in the country to leave immediately[/link], coming as the Taliban captured multiple cities in the last 24 hours.“The U.S. Embassy urges U.S. citizens to leave Afghanistan immediately using available commercial flight options. Given the security conditions and reduced staffing, the Embassys ability to assist U.S. citizens in Afghanistan is extremely limited even within Kabul.”
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It doesnt sit well with me that we asked the Taliban to spare the US embassy. Blinken is sounding like a jack off. We should be saying come here and we will kill every last one of You.
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The entire episode has been shameful, leaving hundreds of thousands to be slaughtered at the hands of barbarians without a proper exit plan, very depressing and disturbing to watch.
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The questions about Afghanistan are rife. There are too many similarities to our abandonment of South Vietnam in 1975. And these “peace talks” are a joke also too similar with negotiating with the North Vietnamese as if the talks were real & not simply a delaying tactic.
Why after 20 years and billions of $ a so-called-rag-tag army that was defeated as we were told is able to over-run the country within a couple of weeks and days as government military and police collapse and in many cases leaving the field without a fight, abandoning their US made equipment to the Taliban.
Abandoning many who helped us because they believed in our cause is a sin & we should help them to get out before they are murdered by the returning Taliban.
Like we should have realized when we “won” the war way back in 2001, our “allies” were corrupt and liable to change sides on a dime for a dime. Of course ignoring Afghanistan where to invade Iraq for made-up excuses did not help and we flucked up that war also again leaving behind a corrupt ineffectual government.
We seem to do very well in supporting inept corrupt governments for many decades now. What’s next? Another Killing Fields due to our efforts?-
What an embarrassment.
I honestly have no words for the shame of this. 20 years of F-ups and wasted money resulting in thousands of needless deaths.-
it’s poop sandwich. Begs a lot of questions. Like we’ve been training Afghan troops for 20 years right? My guess is most of these pussified losers were just in it for a pay check. They got steam rolled by guys in dresses. I get it we lost years ago and should’ve pulled out years ago with better planning. You’ve got to want your own country and I think many of them are just as happy living under the taliban. It’s great if your a caveman.
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The Afghanistan Papers.
[link=https://www.washingtonpost.com/investigations/2021/08/10/afghanistan-papers-book-dick-cheney-attack/]https://www.washingtonpos…ok-dick-cheney-attack/[/link]-
Radio silence. CNN says Biden is expected to address the nation re: Afghanistan in a few days.
Unbelievable
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Pretty please dont damage our embassy! we will be very upset with you and may withhold future Taliban foreign aid.
[link=https://www.nytimes.com/2021/08/12/us/politics/taliban-afghanistan-us-embassy.html]https://www.nytimes.com/2…nistan-us-embassy.html[/link]
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As bad as Trump’s Afghanistan policy was, it wasn’t that bad. When military leaders told him that the afghan government would fold within days after a full withdrawal he backed off. Oh well.
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Yup. I feel bad for all the women and children that are basically going to have their lives go back to wearing sheets and not getting an education. There’s 0 will to fight for themselves, so what’s the point? Even their president flew away with his tail tucked. I’m sure the USA was paying a lot of these people too. Also how much equipment did we leave these people?
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teagan goddard (this pretty much lines up with my views)
[link=https://politicalwire.com/2021/08/16/the-only-way-out-of-a-forever-war/]The Only Way Out of Forever War[/link][/h2]
The last days of the Afghan regime were always going to be ugly no matter how much planning went into it. The heartbreaking videos of Afghans gathering at the airport trying to leave were always going to happen.
Biden had already delayed the withdrawal after Trump promised to leave by May 1. He delayed the exit for for logistical reasons, arguing his predecessor had no plan. The whole point of the last few months was to prepare.
Could it have been done better? One would hope so. But the reality is that nothing about the Afghanistan war has been competent for nearly two decades. Should we really expect it now?
The repeated incompetence of the three previous administrations should have been a reason to leave the country. Instead, it was always used as an excuse to stay a little longer.
As ugly and as desperately sad as it is to watch, Biden took the only way out of forever war.
