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  • jessicasmoon90_0604

    Member
    May 1, 2011 at 8:12 pm

    Nice!

    • jquinones8812_854

      Member
      May 1, 2011 at 8:13 pm

      Hallelujah.

      Kudos to the military, intelligence services, and President Obama.

    • enrirad2000

      Member
      May 1, 2011 at 8:14 pm

      OBL is no more. what a great news.

      • odayjassim1978_476

        Member
        May 1, 2011 at 8:32 pm

        crowds are gathering outside the white house.

      • Unknown Member

        Deleted User
        May 1, 2011 at 8:32 pm

        Great day for America. This one goes out to the thousands that have laid it down. USA

        • Unknown Member

          Deleted User
          May 1, 2011 at 8:37 pm

          Hope it was done up close and personal by a special forces or cia operator. If he was near Islamisbad, the pakistanis have been jerking us around for 10 years.

          • Unknown Member

            Deleted User
            May 1, 2011 at 8:48 pm

            HELL YA!! USA BABY!!

            GROUND FORCES — OUR BOYS ON THE GROUND TOOK HIM OUT!

            • eyoab2011_711

              Member
              May 1, 2011 at 9:05 pm

              Well done military and CIA; no civilian casualties; hopefully a treasure trove of intel in the compound.
               
              A great day for the USA

          • odayjassim1978_476

            Member
            May 1, 2011 at 9:36 pm

            yeah –jerking us around. maybe we will see xrays of the skull.
            but WINNING.

            [image]local://3872/EE9A196CAB644D5598E612810A852D31.jpg[/image]

          • Unknown Member

            Deleted User
            May 1, 2011 at 11:07 pm

            ORIGINAL: vonbraun

             If he was near Islamisbad, the pakistanis have been jerking us around for 10 years.

            <sarcasm> Gee, what gave you that idea? </sarcasm>

            • kayla.meyer_144

              Member
              May 2, 2011 at 2:35 am

              Party time in New York & Washington! Obama & military did it & not by drone.

              [image]local://15813/C33BB96C7FF74F9F8D313AEB127F74C2.jpg[/image]

              • Unknown Member

                Deleted User
                May 2, 2011 at 3:27 am

                ORIGINAL: Frumious

                Party time in New York & Washington! Obama & military did it & not by drone.

                Wow – I agree with you.

                I have been amusing myself looking at google maps for the possible compound. It has been there since 2005, so no doubt it is on the map. Hints: on a dirt road, near to the center of town (although everything could answer that description). 18 ft high wall surrounding the compound with a 7 ft wall surrounding the central part. It was said that the size was 8 times that of the other homes in the area.
                I can’t find it – let’s see if someone else can.

                To the comment regarding if the place was found to be near Islamabad, the Pakistanis are going to have some ‘splainin to do: It is only 35 miles from IB. Not a big town. Rather like if he were hiding in Reston, Va. Not really, though. The town is so small it would be like someone built a very very large palace in Middleburg, Virginia. No one knew who built it or who lived there. Not very suspicious, right?

                Obvious lack of curiosity, probably helped along by some cold cash.

                It gets worse: There are several large Army facilities in town.

                And a little golf course, and the Insitiute of Nuclear Medicine.

                • kayla.meyer_144

                  Member
                  May 2, 2011 at 3:33 am

                  Osama’s final legacy?

                  Sharkbait.

                  • Unknown Member

                    Deleted User
                    May 2, 2011 at 4:14 am

                    When you think of some aspects of this operation, it becomes interesting

                    Someone mentioned using drones.. Well we have missed before, and a lot of other people get killed. So it seems that we had to bite the bullet and do it “by hand” so to speak. Not only that but it seems imperative that a positive ID was made, and so you had to have body in hand.

                    This compound was very large, and would obviously have many hiding places. How did they find him, once in. Insider info?

                    When you are confronted with him, do you capture him? Well, he was shot. Was this determined to be the goal, or were they trying to capture him? If the goal was to kill him, some people are going to be upset about lack of due process (I’m not). Had he been captured, what a problem. Probably would have been some discussion of how we were torturing him. (wouldn’t matter if we were or weren’t – the discussion would be there) Bringing all that up again. A trial – wow – now there is a problem. Think KSM’s trial is a problem – OBL would be magnitudes worse and would cost a large amount of money.

                    What of the other people in the compound. Who was killed and who was left. Probably some bad actors still on the street.

                    They made certain to dispose of the body in a way that he would never again be found, i.e. there will be no physical representation of this particular martyr for his followers to rally around. And, it happened so quickly that he was probably gone by the time the announcement was made that we had killed him.

                    One other thing; Obama just could not resist a backhanded swipe at Bush : “So, shortly after taking office, I directed Leon Panetta, the director of the CIA, to make the killing or capture of OBL the top priority of our war on Al Quaida” Implying that Bush was asleep at the wheel. Probably the first time anyone has accused GWB of being a slacker when it came to military affairs. And – what a brilliant move – we are trying to destroy Al Quaida, so why not make the head guy the number one target!!! Brilliant! Obviously Bush never thought of this.

                    Just proof that politician is a lifetime diagnosis, and incurable.

                    • Unknown Member

                      Deleted User
                      May 2, 2011 at 4:24 am

                      Well if Obama did take a backhanded swipe at bush he was probably just getting even fior the crappy economy that bush left for him to handle

                    • jasbelenecolon_394

                      Member
                      May 2, 2011 at 4:31 am

                      ORIGINAL: Dr.Sardonicus

                      One other thing; Obama just could not resist a backhanded swipe at Bush : “When I came to this job, I made it a top priority to find OBL” Implying that Bush was asleep at the wheel. Probably the first time anyone has accused GWB of being a slacker when it came to military affairs.

                      Just proof that politician is a lifetime diagnosis, and incurable.

                      I wondered how long it would take for the first pathetic @$$ to find someway to criticize BO for this action. It is simply astounding that anyone could have such hatred for the man to instantly believe that he was  making a “swipe at Bush.”
                      I’ll just bet that you consider yourself patriotic. I am disgusted.

                    • Unknown Member

                      Deleted User
                      May 2, 2011 at 4:35 am

                      ORIGINAL: garynuke

                      ORIGINAL: Dr.Sardonicus

                      One other thing; Obama just could not resist a backhanded swipe at Bush : “When I came to this job, I made it a top priority to find OBL” Implying that Bush was asleep at the wheel. Probably the first time anyone has accused GWB of being a slacker when it came to military affairs.

                      Just proof that politician is a lifetime diagnosis, and incurable.

                      I wondered how long it would take for the first pathetic @$$ to find someway to criticize BO for this action. It is simply astounding that anyone could have such hatred for the man to instantly believe that he was  making a “swipe at Bush.”
                      I’ll just bet that you consider yourself patriotic. I am disgusted.

                      You are disgusted. Oh. Sorry.

                      Still – it wasn’t me who made the statement. To me, trying to imply that he, BHO, is the fount of all things righteous is, in your words, disgusting.

                    • jasbelenecolon_394

                      Member
                      May 2, 2011 at 8:49 am

                      ORIGINAL: Dr.Sardonicus

                      You are disgusted. Oh. Sorry.

                      Still – it wasn’t me who made the statement. To me, trying to imply that he, BHO, is the fount of all things righteous is, in your words, disgusting.

                      I have yet to see any post om AM implying that “he, BHO, is the fount of all things righteous.” Your ability to manufacture what you want to see out of others actions, real or imagined, is unparalleled.
                      Reading these types of posts is much like a visit to the hemorrhoid store.
                      Apology is not accepted.
                      *plonk*

                    • Unknown Member

                      Deleted User
                      May 2, 2011 at 9:02 am

                      ORIGINAL: garynuke

                      ORIGINAL: Dr.Sardonicus

                      You are disgusted. Oh. Sorry.

                      Still – it wasn’t me who made the statement. To me, trying to imply that he, BHO, is the fount of all things righteous is, in your words, disgusting.

                      I have yet to see any post om AM implying that “he, BHO, is the fount of all things righteous.” Your ability to manufacture what you want to see out of others actions, real or imagined, is unparalleled.
                      Reading these types of posts is much like a visit to the hemorrhoid store.
                      Apology is not accepted.
                      *plonk*

                      Sorry again. Didn’t mean you. Bad proofreading

                      I meant it is his own pronouncements which read that way to. I will hazard a guess you don’t agree.

                    • Unknown Member

                      Deleted User
                      May 2, 2011 at 9:12 am

                      I bet in a day or two after the Right wing Talking points machine gets together with the Talk show hosts they will formulate a propaganda campaign saying how GW Bush caught Bin Laden and Obama deserves no credit.
                       
                       
                      Just watch, Then 10-12 little parrots will all pop on this board trumpeting the company line.
                       
                      Just watch

                    • jquinones8812_854

                      Member
                      May 2, 2011 at 9:18 am

                      Well, they would be wrong.

                      I am here on record saying Obama deserves all the credit in the world. President Bush and Vice President Cheney have followed similar sentiments.

                      The one place the Bush people deserve credit is in their management of intelligence. Gitmo and Gitmo interrogation information was vital to this capture.

                      Other than that, this is all Obama’s people. Obama pulled the trigger. Obama didn’t hesitate on assassinating him like the Clinton people did. He didn’t worry about unilateral action, basically ignoring Pakistan’s sovereignty for the greater good.

                      I agree, Kpack, some will try to spin it…but other than the intelligence information and apparatus which Bush helped get, the vast, vast majority, 99% of the credit, deserves to go to Obama.

                    • Unknown Member

                      Deleted User
                      May 2, 2011 at 9:33 am

                      I agree to an extent.
                       
                      Bush and Cheney and Rumsfeld did a lot of good things in their management of the Intelligence community.
                       
                      THeir huge mistake however was Iraq, pretty much everything about iraq. Makes you wonder if Osama would have been caught a lot earlier if we weren’t distracted and misled about Iraq
                       
                      It is a real shame because Bush did have the right idea on some key things.  IT is just the obstinance, deception and the narrow mindedness that ruined his presidency

                    • eyoab2011_711

                      Member
                      May 2, 2011 at 9:40 am

                      Predictably there also seems to be a new group of “deathers” those who think Osama is still alive (and those who think this is to distract from the birth certificate debate 😉  ).  I just hope they release the long form death certificate first

                      I really don’t otherwise want to get into the politics since we will all have our own opinion.  We will never know whether Gitmo and harsh interrogation were key to this day or delayed this day.  At the end of at least 4 years of intel gathering by both admins we got the b@st@rd and I admit to not wanting all the gory details that went into this mission. 

                      Gutsy call that could easily have turned into Carter’s failed hostage rescue debacle and given one of the helos had mechanical failure could have.  How he could maintain composure and straight face at the correspondents dinner knowing this was about to go down is pretty amazing IMO.  I guess Obama has answered his 3 am call on national security.

                      Glad to have the SEALS on our side

                    • Unknown Member

                      Deleted User
                      May 2, 2011 at 1:59 pm

                      ORIGINAL: Thor
                      I guess Obama has answered his 3 am call on national security.

                      Ummm giving the order to hunt someone down on foreign soil is not the same as having to deal with an attack on your own country.

                      If that is the extent of a “3 am call”, I think I can make that decision any day.

                      However, I congratulate the intelligence community and our special ops forces for a job well done.  Mission accomplished!  =p

                    • Unknown Member

                      Deleted User
                      May 2, 2011 at 3:00 pm

                      [b]Ummm giving the order to hunt someone down on foreign soil is not the same as having to deal with an attack on your own country.[/b]
                      [b][/b] 
                      IT is actually harder to give the order to hunt someone down on Foreign soil.
                       
                       
                      There is much more to lose if you fail.  Things are much touchier.
                       
                       
                       
                      You should re think your statement.

                    • Unknown Member

                      Deleted User
                      May 2, 2011 at 9:32 pm

                      ORIGINAL: kpack123

                      [b]Ummm giving the order to hunt someone down on foreign soil is not the same as having to deal with an attack on your own country.[/b]
                      [b][/b] 
                      IT is actually harder to give the order to hunt someone down on Foreign soil.

                      There is much more to lose if you fail.  Things are much touchier.

                      You should re think your statement.

                      And you’re naive or delusional.  At any particular moment, we have many covert ops out in the field.  We have 100K troops in Afghanistan in harm’s way.  Sending a few more to their potential death is nothing new to politicians.

                    • Unknown Member

                      Deleted User
                      May 3, 2011 at 4:10 am

                      [b]Sending a few more to their potential death is nothing new to politicians.[/b]

                      Not by sending them into a country whom we are not at war with.

                      Sending them into Afghanistan is no big deal but into pakistan is a huge deal.  We are not war with pakistan and in fact they are supposedly our ally.

                      If the Mission failed you could have seen local pakistanleys dragging boddies through the streets and jeers at america for invading their sovereignty while burning american flags and stirring up the rest of the Arab world

                      That would have been a huge deal

                      I am assuming you are too young to remember Jimmy Carters fiasco in the Iranian desert?

                      I think it is you who are quite naive.
                       
                       
                       
                       

                    • jquinones8812_854

                      Member
                      May 3, 2011 at 4:54 am

                      kpack, dont’ want to get in the middle of your argument…and I basically agree with what you are saying…but is there any question that sending them into Pakistan was the right thing? I am a little confused at your last statement.

                      I do agree that if the mission failed, it could have been as bad as Carter/Iran or Black Hawk Down. But Obama rightfully took the chance.

                    • ruszja

                      Member
                      May 3, 2011 at 5:24 am

                      I put in an email to an acquaintance whom I would call ‘a source close to the leadership of the pakistani airforce’. According to him, this operation was handled the same way as other US operations on Pakistani soil. The leadership knows [u]that[/u] something is happening but not [u]what[/u]. Aftewards, for political expediency, the involvement is denied with angry statements to appease the feelings of the population which is largely hostile to the US cause. 

                    • jquinones8812_854

                      Member
                      May 3, 2011 at 5:29 am

                      fw, Zardari came out today and basically said they were not informed that anything was happening. And we now have confirmation from our military that Pakistani jets were on their way to the location as the helicopters were leaving the area. That doesn’t sound like they ‘knew’ anything…including that something was happening. I think they were completely out of the loop. If it was JUST Zardari’s statement, I would agree with you. But with the sortieing of jets…that says something else all together.

                      I think the entire Pakistani apparatus is now in CYA mode. The failures politically, militarily, and with the intelligence services is stunning.

                    • ruszja

                      Member
                      May 3, 2011 at 6:22 am

                      ORIGINAL: MISTRAD

                      fw, Zardari came out today and basically said they were not informed that anything was happening. And we now have confirmation from our military that Pakistani jets were on their way to the location as the helicopters were leaving the area. That doesn’t sound like they ‘knew’ anything…including that something was happening. I think they were completely out of the loop. If it was JUST Zardari’s statement, I would agree with you. But with the sortieing of jets…that says something else all together.

                       
                      Zadari probably knew nothing. The current civilian goverment exists in parallel to the military and ISI, it controls neither institution.
                       

                    • jquinones8812_854

                      Member
                      May 3, 2011 at 7:12 am

                      Totally agree with that…Zardari is a very weak leader, wouldn’t even be the leader if his wife hadn’t died. Nobody listens to him.

                    • ruszja

                      Member
                      May 3, 2011 at 7:17 am

                      ORIGINAL: MISTRAD

                      Totally agree with that…Zardari is a very weak leader, wouldn’t even be the leader if his wife hadn’t died. Nobody listens to him.

                       
                      And nobody would have listened to his wife either 😉 .
                       
                      Yesterday Anderson Cooper interviewed Musharaf and confronted him with his prior insistence that Bin Laden is in Afganistan. Despite the video of him stating so in the old interview, he kept denying that he ever said so. That is what being the boss for too long will do to your brain.

                    • rolf_824

                      Member
                      May 3, 2011 at 7:25 am

                      all governements in pakistan are weak.
                      the real problem is ISI,taliban and al quaeda are it´s sons

                    • julie.young_645

                      Member
                      May 3, 2011 at 7:58 am

                      Pakistan has much to answer.

                      I think this is a momentous occasion here on the Forum. For the first time, we can all agree that Mr. Obama did something well. The elimination of OBL is certainly cause for celebration. Except of course for our friends in Hamas.

                    • Unknown Member

                      Deleted User
                      May 3, 2011 at 8:27 am

                      Mistrad
                       
                      Yes sending them into Pakistan was definitely the right thing to do but it was very risky.  If Obama chose safety he would have Taking the complex out with a predator Drone and a bomb.
                       
                      THe risk of Failure with boots on the ground is much greater than plausible deniability.

                    • jquinones8812_854

                      Member
                      May 3, 2011 at 8:52 am

                      ORIGINAL: kpack123

                      Mistrad

                      Yes sending them into Pakistan was definitely the right thing to do but it was very risky.  If Obama chose safety he would have Taking the complex out with a predator Drone and a bomb.

                      THe risk of Failure with boots on the ground is much greater than plausible deniability.

                      OK, 100% agree. It was the riskier, but more appropriate, decision.

                    • eyoab2011_711

                      Member
                      May 3, 2011 at 9:02 am

                      I think a drone attack 75 km from Islamabad would have been a diplomatic and public relations nightmare paticularly since it may have been impossible to get and ID the body.  By location, no way this could go down by drone.  To me there were two choices the one decided on or sit back and watch longer.

                      Bet those SEALS also are bringing back some great intel (and info on which to base solid trials on KSM and others)

                    • Unknown Member

                      Deleted User
                      May 3, 2011 at 10:01 am

                      ORIGINAL: Thor

                      I think a drone attack 75 km from Islamabad would have been a diplomatic and public relations nightmare paticularly since it may have been impossible to get and ID the body.  By location, no way this could go down by drone.  To me there were two choices the one decided on or sit back and watch longer.

                      Bet those SEALS also are bringing back some great intel (and info on which to base solid trials on KSM and others)

                      Yeah – check the daily beast. They got a WHOLE lot of stuff. Looking for Al-Zawahiri right now. Wanna bet he’s looking for a realtor/new house?

                      I was surprised that they had time to get the stuff. Each minute spent meant greater risk of being caught and shot down by our friends the pakistanis. But I read today that there were actually 74 men involved. (Some in a heli that didn’t land, there just in case). Obviously some of those going in were tasked with grabbing as much stuff as they could. Probably came with trunks with wheels to move stuff. Navy Seal moving company, sort of.

                      I love it that they built two mock ups of the place for practice. They did it right this time, very cool. It would be interesting to know if they knew the interior architecture of the place, and if so, how.

                      There was a mention in one article that they used “hyperspectral scanning” to find people in the house. It was said it was so high tech that the technology was secret. Wonder if we could use that in Radiology??

                    • Unknown Member

                      Deleted User
                      May 3, 2011 at 10:03 am

                      Well, it can’t be TOO secret:

                      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hyperspectral_imaging

                    • Unknown Member

                      Deleted User
                      May 3, 2011 at 10:55 am

                      This stuff is fascinating.  It could make for an interesting movie. 
                      A couple of interesting twists.  Apparently, the Assange Wikileaks almost blew the operation and forced things into an accelerated schedule, because they disclosed the courrier lead and they actually had the name of the town the CIA was watching.

                      The second is this whole enhanced interrogation issue.  It seems like this was the key to the courrier.
                      [link=http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/us_bin_laden_hunt_for_bin_laden]http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/us_bin_laden_hunt_for_bin_laden[/link]

                      The third developing drama is the capture of Osama’s computers and the “treasure trove” of intelligence it may derive. The computers that were captured may give us the key to the Pakistani “double jeu”.  Wouldn’t that be sweet! 

                    • Unknown Member

                      Deleted User
                      May 3, 2011 at 11:11 am

                      This is directly from your article
                       
                      [i][b]Mohammed did not discuss al-Kuwaiti while being subjected to the simulated drowning technique known as waterboarding, former officials said. He acknowledged knowing him many months later under standard interrogation, they said, leaving it once again up for debate as to whether the harsh technique was a valuable tool or an unnecessarily violent tactic.[/b][/i]

                    • jquinones8812_854

                      Member
                      May 3, 2011 at 11:18 am

                      Kpack, MSNBC is now disputing that, with Michael Isakoff saying it was under harsh interrogation.

                      Frankly, I doubt we will know for a long time, if ever, when exactly the information came about. I don’t trust the Obama people nor the Bush people to give us a truly honest answer. The Obama people want nothing to do with harsh interrogations; the Bush people are trying to vindicate their actions. The best information we have obtained on this stuff came from independent commission reports and investigations…which will take years.

                      And I am not sure it matters…no one is going to use harsh interrogations anytime soon…it only matters in the terms of historical perspective.

                    • Unknown Member

                      Deleted User
                      May 3, 2011 at 11:29 am

                      I don’t think it matter either and personally I could care less if they waterboarded or not but we should all just stick to facts instead of spin

                    • palomareeves_533

                      Member
                      May 3, 2011 at 11:30 am

                      the facts as you know them right?

                    • jquinones8812_854

                      Member
                      May 3, 2011 at 11:35 am

                      No, let us be fair…I think kpack is right…I just don’t think we absolutely know the facts. I think it is possible that waterboarding did achieve the info…but we likely won’t confirm that for years. But the reverse is true as well…I don’t think liberals can honestly say that harsh interrogations didn’t provide vital info for this.

                      And as I said, I am not sure it matters, other for posterity sake.

                    • Unknown Member

                      Deleted User
                      May 3, 2011 at 12:50 pm

                      [b]the facts as you know them right?[/b]
                       
                      Facts are facts 
                       
                      If they are in dispute they really aren’t factual they are kinda like he said she said

                    • kayla.meyer_144

                      Member
                      May 3, 2011 at 1:11 pm

                      Even Cheney says he “assumes” the information came as a result of torture. The irony is that after sweeping the issue under a rug this braggadocio might create a reason to actually open investigations & prosecutions for torture.

                    • Unknown Member

                      Deleted User
                      May 3, 2011 at 1:16 pm

                      I think what are friends on the right our attempting to do is add 2 plus 2 and make it 5

                      Basically  Some Info Came from Khalid Sheik Mohammed —-2

                      Shiek Khakid mohammed was water boarded several times— 2

                      Therefore the info obtained must have came from waterboarding—-5

                      I am sorry but That is not how facts are developed.  At least not where I come from.

                    • jquinones8812_854

                      Member
                      May 3, 2011 at 1:31 pm

                      Like I said…no one on either side has evidence either way. We simply do not know.

                      I do not state waterboarding was used in this case. But in the same vein, you guys do not know if it is not the case. If you say otherwise, you are lying.

                      As for whether waterboarding is worthwhile is a political and moral question. Whether it helped provide info in this case is a factual argument, not a moral or political one.

                      Kpack hit the nail on the head…facts have to be developed, and right now we don’t know anything.

                      And no matter where the info came from…Obama got him. That is the end result, no matter what.

                    • Unknown Member

                      Deleted User
                      May 3, 2011 at 1:37 pm

                      [b]But in the same vein, you guys do not know if it is not the case[/b]
                      [b][/b] 
                      Absolutely but it was the right that first brought this argument up so they should at least have to support their claims.
                       
                       
                       
                      Personally I like to see the truth come out if the CIA and the interrogators really feel that Waterbaording got this answer I think the public has the right to know.

                    • raddoc77

                      Member
                      May 3, 2011 at 7:57 pm

                      What we are all seeing is the Hollywood version of what happened….We will never know what went down, really.  I am sure that someone is writng a book as we speak, half of which will be redacted…It sure puts a good light on the Military, though.

                      What I do know is “The Base” changed the way we live forever in this country, and the World.  We will never have the freedoms we used to, when we traveled.  Or at home, for that matter.

                      Bin Laden’s organization shorted the Markets after 9/11 and cost a lot of us money, whilst making themselves rich.

                      As for the Presidents…Clinton just pissed them off with a few cruise missiles, Bush was in the thick of it at 9/11 and Guantanamo, and Obama was at the right place at the right time to make the call.  Nevertheless, it’s a moral victory for the US.

                      http://angiographer.com

                    • jquinones8812_854

                      Member
                      May 3, 2011 at 8:00 pm

                      Kpack, all I want is ultimately to know the whole and unadulterated truth…and that will take years. We still do not know everything from sept 11, for example.

                    • 19462008

                      Member
                      May 3, 2011 at 8:30 pm

                      Did water boarding get the answers? Maybe, Maybe not. Everyones either saying it did or it didn’t. Basically, I really don’t care. The male Islamic radicals captured and obtained have had only one thing on their minds for years…. Killing us and those who associate with us, by whatever means they have. That’s including using their own innocent children with bombs on their backs to do their killings.  So in my eyes, I see pure evil and have no respect for their concerns.  
                       
                      Bin Laden is dead, and the last person he saw was an American Soldier. I hope he Sh*t his pants before the trigger was pulled. The most valuble aspect of this action (and I praise the President for taking a strong continued action plan) is that our government vowed to hunt down those involved, and kill them. I would hate to be a name on one those computers that were recovered from the raid. Paradise is just around the corner for them.  

                    • Unknown Member

                      Deleted User
                      May 3, 2011 at 9:05 pm

                      Prophetic words:
                      “Whether we bring our enemies to justice or bring justice to our enemies, justice will be done … We should not expect one battle, but a lengthy campaign, unlike any other we have ever seen. It may include dramatic strikes, visible on TV, and covert operations, secret even in success. We will starve terrorists of funding, turn them one against another, drive them from place to place, until there is no refuge or no rest.” G. W. Bush, Sept 2001.

                      Given the current state of Al Quaeda, I would say those were prophetic words. Thank-you W.

                    • Unknown Member

                      Deleted User
                      May 4, 2011 at 12:37 am

                      ORIGINAL: aldadoc

                      Prophetic words:
                      “Whether we bring our enemies to justice or bring justice to our enemies, justice will be done … We should not expect one battle, but a lengthy campaign, unlike any other we have ever seen. It may include dramatic strikes, visible on TV, and covert operations, secret even in success. We will starve terrorists of funding, turn them one against another, drive them from place to place, until there is no refuge or no rest.” G. W. Bush, Sept 2001.

                      Given the current state of Al Quaeda, I would say those were prophetic words. Thank-you W.

                      Blasphemy!  How can you quote the words of that infidel?!!

                      Obama alone is responsible for the success of this operation.  He alone gave the order.

                    • Unknown Member

                      Deleted User
                      May 4, 2011 at 3:22 am

                      OO BOY

                      a Double feature

                      The hidden trophy of Sunday’s raid: The JSOC team captured intelligence materials from the compound that might reveal the location of Ayman al-Zawahiri, the organization’s new commander. “That’s where we’re going next,” says one U.S. official involved in planning the operation.

                      Stay tuned

                    • jquinones8812_854

                      Member
                      May 4, 2011 at 4:07 am

                      Again, for Zawahiri, it will take skill, luck, and one kernel of evidence to find him…that is how it always works.

                    • jquinones8812_854

                      Member
                      May 4, 2011 at 5:01 am

                      For whatever it is worth…Panetta confirms that harsh interrogations did provide key clues to Osama’s location…

                      http://today.msnbc.msn.com/id/42880435/ns/today-today_news/

                      “Enhanced interrogation techniques” were used to extract information that led to the mission’s success, Panetta said during an interview with anchor Brian Williams. Those techniques included waterboarding, he acknowledged.
                      Panetta, who in a 2009 CIA confirmation hearing declared “waterboarding is torture and it’s wrong,” said Tuesday that debate about its use will continue.
                      “Whether we would have gotten the same information through other approaches I think is always gonna be an open question,” Panetta said.
                      “In the intelligence business you work from a lot of sources of information and that was true here,” Panetta said. “We had a multiple source a multiple series of sources that provided information with regards to the situation. Clearly some of it came from detainees and the interrogation of detainees but we also had information from other sources as well.”

                    • Unknown Member

                      Deleted User
                      May 4, 2011 at 4:38 pm

                      I think you should strike the term “key”

                      The only thing stated were that harsh interrogation techniques obtained some info

                      Again I could care less if they water boarded. I just don’t known if it works

                      I tend to agree with John McCain on this. If you are being tortured you are going to tell them anything true or false just to make them stop. How do you know what is what

                    • Unknown Member

                      Deleted User
                      May 4, 2011 at 6:28 pm

                      Interesting info today:

                      We knew there were 22 people living there, and there was one adult male who was never seen outside of the building.

                      How?

                      They read the vibrations of the windows with a laser during conversations. Then they put the signal through a voice analyzer. They can tell children, women, men, and apparently can analyze deeply enough to identify individuals. They had one adult male voice unaccounted for when watching the people come and go.

                      So – that would make me a little more comfortable ordering the raid.

                      As an aside – The guy and his family were essentially prisoners fro 5 years. I feel badly for the kids, none of them apparently went to school (of course). They were also prisoners.

                    • kayla.meyer_144

                      Member
                      May 5, 2011 at 10:53 am

                      Interesting errors in the news:

                      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mMP7Ys57ha4

                      [image]local://15813/58637F3C224A4769B360EBB9547C7430.jpg[/image]

                    • odayjassim1978_476

                      Member
                      May 5, 2011 at 11:28 am

                      Meet the real [b][size=4]BO[/size][/b]=[i]Bush/Obama[/i].3rd term and soon 4th.  They got me.

                      [image]local://3872/08ED2AC581304249B09E02318BFE677C.jpg[/image]

                    • odayjassim1978_476

                      Member
                      May 5, 2011 at 4:45 pm

                      Now, wait a  minute I am the [size=4][b]REAL[/b][/size] [u]BO[/u] and I luv walks on the lawn and cannot wait to see hoodwinked 2 with my first FAMILY.
                       
                       
                       

                      ORIGINAL: Noah’sArk

                      Meet the real [b][size=4]BO[/size][/b]=[i]Bush/Obama[/i].3rd term and soon 4th.  They got me.

                      [image]local://3872/08ED2AC581304249B09E02318BFE677C.jpg[/image]

                      [image]local://3872/DA3E9F3512B34354B9CA847D11221DD4.jpg[/image]

                    • eyoab2011_711

                      Member
                      May 7, 2011 at 8:53 am

                      [link=http://ordinary-gentlemen.com/blog/2011/05/05/the-meaninglessness-of-claims-that-torture-worked/]http://ordinary-gentlemen.com/blog/2011/05/05/the-meaninglessness-of-claims-that-torture-worked/[/link]
                       
                      Knowing this will not change minds, this is a nicely written piece.  Truly we will never know if torture was necessary to get to the result with OBL and each side has the ability to perceive what they wish.

                    • Unknown Member

                      Deleted User
                      May 7, 2011 at 11:06 am

                      So he basically said Torture works because president Bush said so in a 2006 speech?
                       
                      That is his basis for a fact?
                       
                       

                    • jquinones8812_854

                      Member
                      May 7, 2011 at 2:11 pm

                      I agree that we will likely not know if and how much the harsh interrogations were key to the capture of OBL for a long time, if ever. And like I said before, it doesn’t really matter, except on internet forums. For the foreseeable future the use of harsh interrogations is simply not acceptable to the American public.

                    • odayjassim1978_476

                      Member
                      May 7, 2011 at 9:00 pm

                      well SNL is not disappointing–I knew to tune in and then they did the GOP debate w/ Sarah’s dig at Katie and ending with –THANK U  FROM THE REELECT OBAMA crusade.

                    • Unknown Member

                      Deleted User
                      May 7, 2011 at 10:16 pm

                      ORIGINAL: kpack123

                      So he basically said Torture works because president Bush said so in a 2006 speech?

                      That is his basis for a fact?

                      Yes, the only thing of any substance in the article was van Dyke’s quoting of the former CIA director who simply referred to Bush’s speech. Somehow, I do recall certain other statements made by the Bush White House, Cabinet, and intelligence agencies during that time that turned out to be disastrously false.

                      In any case, there was nothing in that article claiming that finding bin Laden was in any way the result of information acquired by torture.

                    • odayjassim1978_476

                      Member
                      May 13, 2011 at 8:40 pm

                      Washington kept a secrete– lol.  as a native Washingtonian, I know how people like to claim they are in the KNOW cause they have a cousin who is a housekeeper for so and so–like pleez. But some are feeling a little more privledge now cause at least they got to see the pics.

                      ORIGINAL: Lux

                      ORIGINAL: kpack123

                      So he basically said Torture works because president Bush said so in a 2006 speech?

                      That is his basis for a fact?

                      Yes, the only thing of any substance in the article was van Dyke’s quoting of the former CIA director who simply referred to Bush’s speech. Somehow, I do recall certain other statements made by the Bush White House, Cabinet, and intelligence agencies during that time that turned out to be disastrously false.

                      In any case, there was nothing in that article claiming that finding bin Laden was in any way the result of information acquired by torture.

                    • eyoab2011_711

                      Member
                      May 14, 2011 at 6:59 am

                      What really happened
                      [link=http://www.toledoblade.com/Editorial-Cartoons/2011/05/10/Kirk-Raid-on-bin-Laden.html]http://www.toledoblade.com/Editorial-Cartoons/2011/05/10/Kirk-Raid-on-bin-Laden.html[/link]
                       
                       
                      [image]http://www.toledoblade.com/image/2011/05/09/300x_b1_z_cT_%232285/kirktoon-5-10-11.jpg[/image]

                    • odayjassim1978_476

                      Member
                      May 14, 2011 at 1:53 pm

                      lol–a woman’s wrath.

                      ORIGINAL: Thor

                      What really happened
                      [link=http://www.toledoblade.com/Editorial-Cartoons/2011/05/10/Kirk-Raid-on-bin-Laden.html]http://www.toledoblade.com/Editorial-Cartoons/2011/05/10/Kirk-Raid-on-bin-Laden.html[/link]

                      [image]http://www.toledoblade.com/image/2011/05/09/300x_b1_z_cT_%232285/kirktoon-5-10-11.jpg[/image]

                    • odayjassim1978_476

                      Member
                      May 14, 2011 at 9:31 pm

                      DC runs on privledged info–who knows and what do they know.  whose up and whose down.

                      ORIGINAL: Noah’sArk

                      lol–a woman’s wrath.

                      ORIGINAL: Thor

                      What really happened
                      [link=http://www.toledoblade.com/Editorial-Cartoons/2011/05/10/Kirk-Raid-on-bin-Laden.html]http://www.toledoblade.com/Editorial-Cartoons/2011/05/10/Kirk-Raid-on-bin-Laden.html[/link]

                      [image]http://www.toledoblade.com/image/2011/05/09/300x_b1_z_cT_%232285/kirktoon-5-10-11.jpg[/image]

                    • raallen

                      Member
                      May 15, 2011 at 2:10 pm

                      It’s fairly clear that the intelligence that lead to Bin Laden’s death came from enhanced interrogations. But the left can not accept that waterboarding is not regarded as torture by a consensus. The NYTimes, for whatever reason and without context, had to reinforce/remind the ‘nastiness’ of the Bush administration last week when it became clear that their intelligence gathering lead to the death of America’s biggest enemy and the terror lord Bin Laden.

                      Thus, in regard to the Bin Laden death, hard liberals have been left with their collective pants on the ground. American, including democrats, accept the killing of Bin Laden’s and tacitly accept that enhanced interrogations were an important component of this decapitation of terrorism. It’s up to the left now to gain any legitimacy to redact part of their smear labeling of President Bush, Vice President Cheney, the intelligence community, and the military on whole for their illegitimate hyperbole and polemic politics of the last decade. Patriots were smeared similarly by the same left wing media-institutional cabals during and immediately after every military action in the last 1/2 century. During the same time, America has had her longest periods of  peace and prosperity. The disconnect is on the left, and Bin Laden’s death and its critics of the action itself and the policies that lead directly to its execution have been left to be viewed as near-useless pacifists like Michael Moore.

                    • eyoab2011_711

                      Member
                      May 15, 2011 at 3:24 pm

                      Ummmm no, we know that in every other occassion waterboarding has been prosecuted as torture; we know that those tortured resisted giving up the information (even 183 times); we know it took regular interrogations to undo the damage and falsehoods of EIT,  What the torture apologists cannot get around is that if torture worked so well it wouldn’t have taken 5 years to get from a pseudonym to a real name and only when experienced interrogators building rapport got involved using every day intelligence gathering techniques that we began to unravel the whereabouts of bin Laden.
                       
                      The neo-cons are desperately crawling out of their holes trying to vindicate their immoral activities.  But some day they will get the opportunity to interogate bin Laden in he!!

                    • jquinones8812_854

                      Member
                      May 15, 2011 at 3:28 pm

                      We also know that we have documented evidence of waterboarding giving actionable intelligence.  Don’t portray it as that one sided.  And in several instances, according to Senate committees, the intelligence could not have been obtained any other way.
                       
                      This is a political and moral question.  I personally think, right now, we don’t need it, and should not do it.  But to say you don’t get intelligence from it simply ignores the facts at hand.

                    • Unknown Member

                      Deleted User
                      May 15, 2011 at 4:57 pm

                      Seems the real debate is does enhanced interrogation give better results than regular interrogation

                      I have seen no strong evidence to support enhanced techniques over regular techniques. It seems like most stuff I read feels enhanced techniques leads to more false info

                    • jasbelenecolon_394

                      Member
                      May 15, 2011 at 5:18 pm

                      I wonder if that consensus opinion that waterboarding is not torture was from a cohort of people who have been waterboarded?

                      In any event, I feel that the results can often justify the methods. There are some things about which I have no moral qualms. And I am not concerned about how others feel about my position; it is just an opinion after all. YMMV

                    • odayjassim1978_476

                      Member
                      May 15, 2011 at 7:45 pm

                      AMEN That’s your opinion and u can voice it in this country on a website. Let me share 2 lttle rules of sdvice given to me by my mom–sleep only with people who have as much to lose as u and judge the character of your so call friends when the chips are down.
                       

                      ORIGINAL: garynuke

                      I wonder if that consensus opinion that waterboarding is not torture was from a cohort of people who have been waterboarded?

                      In any event, I feel that the results can often justify the methods. There are some things about which I have no moral qualms. And I am not concerned about how others feel about my position; it is just an opinion after all. YMMV

                    • raallen

                      Member
                      May 15, 2011 at 7:55 pm

                      Gary,

                      The SEALS go through waterbordering training themselves. It is strenuous, however, there is a consensus that it certain is not a death march, beatings or starvation, as many on the fringes of the political spectrum branded it out of political expediency without thought. The times Americans have crossed the line, as in Abu Gharib, it has been thoroughly adjudicated. There is NO equivalency between the actions of America in comparison to what lets say what the Japanese empire did to our POWs. The Abu Gharib perpetrators were all prosecuted and many have served multi-year hard time in jail.  Honestly, there maybe a theoretical slippery-slope in using waterbording. But, it seems to be playing a fright-flight response to extract information, and this time it turned into success. Also, is the penalty that KSM or other terrorists are facing-the death penality and long-time prison internment any more or less of a ‘torture’?

                      Michael Moore and Ron Paul are off their rocker in considering this the bin Laden killing as a crime, considering the multi-continental threat Al-queada poses to the US. Michael Moore would probably issue Robespierre-like death penalties to bankers at random rather than pursue a terrorist.

                    • eyoab2011_711

                      Member
                      May 16, 2011 at 9:44 am

                      http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/plum-line/post/exclusive-private-letter-from-cia-chief-undercuts-claim-torture-was-key-to-killing-bin-laden/2011/03/03/AFLFF04G_blog.html

                      Panetta not only minimizes the utility of torture in this but also points to the fact that they received plenty of misleading information through torture.

                      RVU-the SEALS are training to RESIST TORTURE; you do that by voluntarily undergoing TORTURE techniques not read about them in a book.  The fact that they must train to resist the effects of waterboarding says volumes.  Moreover, the fact that all military personnel who could be a POW do not also says something.  There are lots of unpleasant things I did in the military to train for worst case scenarios and be prepared–waterboarding was not one of them and for good reason–it is torture

                    • Unknown Member

                      Deleted User
                      May 3, 2011 at 11:34 am

                      I agree with Mistrad.  We’re not going to get a straight answer on this anytime soon, especially from the US press. They are too invested in their fight against enhanced interrogation.  I would wait for the foreign press to sort this out.  Here’s a Telegraph account.

                      [link=http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/al-qaeda/8489866/WikiLeaks-Bin-Ladens-courier-trained-911-hijack-team.html]http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/al-qaeda/8489866/WikiLeaks-Bin-Ladens-courier-trained-911-hijack-team.html[/link]

                      Either way, this is an American victory, not an Obama victory.  Credit should be given to all involved, including the CIA, Military intelligence, the Navy Seals, Bush and Obama. 

                    • kayla.meyer_144

                      Member
                      May 3, 2011 at 11:49 am

                      As for Michael Isikoff:

                      http://www.whereistheoutrage.net/wordpress/

                      [b]Khalid Shaikh Mohammed[/b] was captured in 2003. According to reports, [link=http://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/osama-bin-laden-is-killed-by-us-forces-in-pakistan/2011/05/01/AFXMZyVF_story.html]it was 2005[/link] before the CIA began to get information about a courier that was working for Osama bin Laden. The dates dont seem to match. Did the CIA sit on information for two years? Separate reports state that the CIA was given a pseudonym for the courier. The CIA needed to do more leg work in order to find out the couriers real name and where the courier was located. Again, this doesnt quite add up. If, for example, I tell you that Popeye the Sailor is a close confidant of Osama bin Laden Im not sure thats going to help you much. On the other hand, if I can give you a couriers real name and where he actually lives in Pakistan, that would probably be helpful.
                      On the Last Word last night, Michael Isikoff, veteran reporter from Newsweek, mentions there are clearly some questions about whether these enhanced interrogations (torture) really gleaned valuable information. Watch the video:

                    • Unknown Member

                      Deleted User
                      May 3, 2011 at 12:05 pm

                      I am no fan of Obama but he did make a gutsy call and I give him a lot of credit for this one.  

                    • odayjassim1978_476

                      Member
                      May 3, 2011 at 12:35 pm

                      Well my favorite Russian newspaper{PRAVDA} is at it again—I was wondering why it took over 24 hours for them to comment on Osama’s reported death but they finally put something on line and it was a quite comical–the article titled Bin laden dead: so what? and then goes on to say some anonymous US official has said Usama bin laden is dead.  Well, like it was 10:30 pm interruption of celebrity apprentice by the President of the United Staes who informed the country.  sOunds bitter–wonder why –though the paper does report Russia lost a deal to India.

                    • kayla.meyer_144

                      Member
                      May 3, 2011 at 11:40 am

                      ORIGINAL: MISTRAD

                      There are many links that say that Khalid Shekh Mumhammed is the primary source of this information.

                      We also know from documents that KSM did not talk at all before waterboarding. That is a documented fact.

                      ORIGINAL: aldadoc

                      The second is this whole enhanced interrogation issue.  It seems like this was the key to the courrier.
                      [link=http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/us_bin_laden_hunt_for_bin_laden]http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/us_bin_laden_hunt_for_bin_laden[/link]

                      The myth that won’t die, torture your enemies to get the facts. What is the impetus? Revenge?

                      The CIA never reported that torture brought actionable or usable results. At best is is inferred if your analysis is sloppy & you want a desired result, ie, “torture works!”

                      The earlier reports was that KSM talked endlessly virtually bragging about his involvement before the water torture (183 times in 1 month in 2003!). I do recall him “confessing” to all sorts of strange things. Maybe they applied the water torture purely out of spite for his bragging & to shut him up. I also recall him talking long after water torture with debriefers/interrogators using normal interrogation techniques, as in “debriefing” techniques.

                      As kpack notes, Alda’s AP article even states that information was gained under standard techniques of interrogation.

                      http://www.harpers.org/archive/2009/08/hbc-90005633

                      According to a former senior intelligence officer who requested anonymity because the events are still classified, KSM was brought around through the use of torture. Techniques applied to KSM included sleep deprivation and waterboarding.
                      Considering that the CIAs own declassified report on intelligence gained from KSM fails to make such claimseven though the Bush Administration was plainly hoping it would do just thatthe [i]WaPo[/i] story raised some questions.
                      If the waterboarding of KSM gave interrogators access to information that earlier interrogators could not obtain, why doesnt the CIAs report and analysis say that? It doesnt, as even [link=http://harpers.org/archive/2009/08/hbc-90005607]Frances Townsend was forced to concede[/link] in a CNN interview. Yet Dick Cheney was pressing hard for just such an account.
                      [b]Are the claims that KSM wasnt cooperating before he was tortured correct?[/b] Actually, a good amount of contrary evidence exists. [b]It starts with Yosri Foudas Al Jazeera interview with KSM. Fouda found KSM remarkably proud of his involvement in Al Qaeda strikes and delighted to talk about them, with the camera rolling. And indeed, little of what KSM said in that interview turns out to be dissemblingunlike a large number of wholly implausible claims KSM made after being subjected to waterboarding. In her book [i]The Dark Side[/i], Jane Mayer musters an impressive list of sources making the same claim, essentially that KSM was a cooperative witness from the get-go.[/b]

                      http://harpers.org/archive/2009/08/hbc-90005607

                      The centerpiece of Dick Cheneys six-week-long torture tour, in which he made the case that torture works, was a claim that there were two CIA studies that proved him right. He repeated this claim in several speeches, most prominently in a high-profile address at the American Enterprise Institute that he delivered just as President Obama gave his own speech at the National Archives. Cheney called on the CIA to declassify and release the documents. On Monday evening, they were released. Read the documents [link=http://washingtonindependent.com/56310/obtained-the-cia-documents-dick-cheney-says-vindicate-torture]here.[/link]
                      In them youll find an interesting discussion of what the CIA learned from its interrogations of Khalid Shayk Mohammed and other terrorists. But look as much as you like, you wont find anything that supports Cheneys claim that application of the torture techniques led to the discovery of intelligence that saved American lives. The available evidence, moreover, suggests the opposite. [b]KSM was happy to volunteer information to anyone who asked, as al Jazeeras Yosri Fouda discovered when he interviewed the 9/11 mastermind. KSMs handlers reported that he freely, even proudly, gave up useful information without the need for coercion. So what happened when the rough stuff was applied? The information he continued to supply got a whole lot less reliable. Suddenly KSM was confessing to all sorts of things he couldnt possibly have done[/b].

                      http://washingtonindependent.com/56310/obtained-the-cia-documents-dick-cheney-says-vindicate-torture

                      There’s a lot more information out there, none of it justifies torture as a means of gaining information. Turn off [u][b]24[/b][/u] re-runs.

                      KSM was tortured in 2003, so it took 8 years before the information could be used? If torture was so effective, why only an alias, why not the real name? The real name was only found 4 years ago.

                      Sloppy thinking for a desired conclusion is the only conclusion to be drawn why torture needs to be justified.

                    • Unknown Member

                      Deleted User
                      May 3, 2011 at 9:00 am

                      ORIGINAL: kpack123

                      [b]Sending a few more to their potential death is nothing new to politicians.[/b]

                      Not by sending them into a country whom we are not at war with.

                      Sending them into Afghanistan is no big deal but into pakistan is a huge deal.  We are not war with pakistan and in fact they are supposedly our ally.

                      If the Mission failed you could have seen local pakistanleys dragging boddies through the streets and jeers at america for invading their sovereignty while burning american flags and stirring up the rest of the Arab world

                      That would have been a huge deal

                      I am assuming you are too young to remember Jimmy Carters fiasco in the Iranian desert?

                      I think it is you who are quite naive.

                      Oh, I remember Carter’s blunder.

                      At any moment, we have covert ops in countries with which we are not at war. But it’s only a blunder if we get caught red-handed.  We sent men into Pakistan and yet there are no significant repercussions.  That’s because we found our “ally” supporting the most wanted terrorist.  We send drones into Pakistan to kill their people every day.  Our CIA ops got caught and accused of murdering their civilians. I hardly call these issues “3 am” phone call issues.

                    • Unknown Member

                      Deleted User
                      May 2, 2011 at 9:42 am

                      ORIGINAL: MISTRAD

                      Well, they would be wrong.

                      I am here on record saying Obama deserves all the credit in the world. President Bush and Vice President Cheney have followed similar sentiments.

                      The one place the Bush people deserve credit is in their management of intelligence. Gitmo and Gitmo interrogation information was vital to this capture.

                      Other than that, this is all Obama’s people. Obama pulled the trigger. Obama didn’t hesitate on assassinating him like the Clinton people did. He didn’t worry about unilateral action, basically ignoring Pakistan’s sovereignty for the greater good.

                      I agree, Kpack, some will try to spin it…but other than the intelligence information and apparatus which Bush helped get, the vast, vast majority, 99% of the credit, deserves to go to Obama.

                      Your astute objectivity is very much appreciated at this very important moment of truth.

                    • jquinones8812_854

                      Member
                      May 2, 2011 at 9:47 am

                      Kpack, I think we agree on this one totally.

                      Thor, as for ‘deathers’…most of the muslim world will probably fall into this category. Pictures have to be released; otherwise they will never accept the death.

                      Politically…no idea long term, but short term…this is as big a ‘win’ for Obama as anyone can think of.

                    • eyoab2011_711

                      Member
                      May 2, 2011 at 9:51 am

                      I think this makes him solid on security issues, but ’12 will be all about the economy and this will be a blip on the radar.  I’m kind of glad that this won’t have a decided effect on the election “October surprise”, because although a great moment should not define our choice for President

                    • Unknown Member

                      Deleted User
                      May 2, 2011 at 3:43 pm

                      ORIGINAL: Thor

                      I think this makes him solid on security issues, but ’12 will be all about the economy and this will be a blip on the radar.  I’m kind of glad that this won’t have a decided effect on the election “October surprise”, because although a great moment should not define our choice for President

                      Agree – the ’91 success in Kuwait – arguably better since the entire Iraqi Army was dispatched in 3 days – had no discernable positive effect for Bush in ’92

                    • ruszja

                      Member
                      May 2, 2011 at 4:18 pm

                      Had the Paki military shot down the choppers and angry villagers dragged the corpses of the seals around town, the blame would have squarely fallen on Obama, not Bush. This was his his decision, it worked out well, he deserves the credit.
                       
                      On a different issue: The US military is loosing more helicopters to mechanical failure than enemy action. Dont know what they used on this mission, but there ought to be some serious investigation why it is that they loose so many helos (and good men). Isn’t that kind of operation what the Osprey was supposed to be for……:whistle:

                    • jquinones8812_854

                      Member
                      May 2, 2011 at 4:27 pm

                      ORIGINAL: fw

                      Had the Paki military shot down the choppers and angry villagers dragged the corpses of the seals around town, the blame would have squarely fallen on Obama, not Bush. This was his his decision, it worked out well, he deserves the credit.

                      On a different issue: The US military is loosing more helicopters to mechanical failure than enemy action. Dont know what they used on this mission, but there ought to be some serious investigation why it is that they loose so many helos (and good men). Isn’t that kind of operation what the Osprey was supposed to be for……:whistle:

                      Absolutely…this could have easily ended up like Carter’s Iran hostage mission.

                      As for helicopters…I was told by a military expert on helicopters several years ago that this is basically the failure rate of helicopters…that this was pretty much expected…kind of crazy, huh?

                    • Unknown Member

                      Deleted User
                      May 2, 2011 at 6:15 pm

                      I thought I read one took a hit from a rocket propelled grenade

                    • ruszja

                      Member
                      May 2, 2011 at 6:26 pm

                      ORIGINAL: MISTRAD
                      As for helicopters…I was told by a military expert on helicopters several years ago that this is basically the failure rate of helicopters…that this was pretty much expected…kind of crazy, huh?

                       
                      Well, maybe in battlefield service.
                       
                      Every year, 100eds of thousands of hours are flown in the civilian sector for everything from medevac to off-shore platform supply. Yes, accidents happen, at times including bad accidents (e.g. the S92 that went down off Nova Scotia 2 years ago), but their rate of catastrophic failures compared to the hours and passenger miles flown is low.
                       
                      Bin Laden participated in the eviction of the russians from Afganistan with that nifty Stinger missile. It would be rather suprising if his compound didn’t have some type of air-defense capability.

                    • jquinones8812_854

                      Member
                      May 2, 2011 at 6:31 pm

                      fw, I am absolutely no helicopter expert…just telling you what I heard.

                      Those helicopters are so good at coming in fast and quiet though, they may not have heard them until the last moments. Additionally, with a Pakistani military compound nearby, they may have thought the noise was from there.

                      Kpack, the reports from CNN and MSNBC are saying mechanical difficulty…but who knows. I don’t care because the end result is the same: success.

                    • ruszja

                      Member
                      May 2, 2011 at 6:32 pm

                      All the TV blabbermouths are talking about how the Paki goverment must have known about him being there simply because the house was so big and out of place with its high walls. There are plenty of wealthy and private individuals in those countries, a ‘compound’ is simply what you build if you have the means to do it.
                       
                      I fully expect a show-trial of some lower-level pakistani goverment servant in the upcoming months. There will be some acknowledgement that he had protections, those will be ‘rooted out’ and the US aid to arm pakistan against the impending indian invasion will keep flowing (makes you wonder whether the pakis would have a shot against a nuke attack from india if they couldn’t find the seal choppers for the 3 hrs or so they crossed paki territory).

                    • jquinones8812_854

                      Member
                      May 2, 2011 at 7:05 pm

                      fw, the city they were in is an exception. That town is meant for military big wigs. Some places in the town require special permits and security clearances to build. Additionally, one thing in both Pakistan and India? Bureaucracy. You need so many ridiculous permits to build anything, and have to bribe so many lower level govt officials…it is impossible in my mind that you could build that place without someone knowing. You can’t just build a compound in these areas without getting govt permission…it can’t happen. And a compound of this magnitude in Pakistan would have taken some serious bribery to get built.

                      If there was ANYWHERE in that country the govt should have found him…this is it.

                      Even people interviewed in the town were saying it was unbelievable the govt didn’t know that he was there.

                      As for nukes…different kind of radar, the helicopters fly much lower, and are much harder to pick up. Most radar is built for higher level targets.

                    • ruszja

                      Member
                      May 2, 2011 at 7:37 pm

                      ORIGINAL: MISTRAD

                      fw, the city they were in is an exception. That town is meant for military big wigs. Some places in the town require special permits and security clearances to build. Additionally, one thing in both Pakistan and India? Bureaucracy. You need so many ridiculous permits to build anything, and have to bribe so many lower level govt officials…it is impossible in my mind that you could build that place without someone knowing. You can’t just build a compound in these areas without getting govt permission…it can’t happen. And a compound of this magnitude in Pakistan would have taken some serious bribery to get built.

                       
                      You think they put ‘Application for zoning variance, Osama Bin Laden petitioner’ on the planning commission agenda ?
                       
                      Of course it wasn’t him who built the thing, greased the right hands etc.

                    • jquinones8812_854

                      Member
                      May 2, 2011 at 7:39 pm

                      Of course not. But when intelligence agencies are supposed to be looking for something suspicious…this should have been suspicious.

                      The reality is Pakistani intelligence services did not want to find OBL in their country. They never did. If OBL was in the mountains, they had plausible deniability. Here, in a town like this, this is much less believable

                      I guess it is possible that they didn’t know…but that then would ask the question of how incompetent they truly are.

                    • odayjassim1978_476

                      Member
                      May 2, 2011 at 8:00 pm

                      remember ?? (spelling)Musharraf boohooing that he had been told his country would be bombed back to the stone age when the Iraq war started. And this compound exist right out there in the open.  But, I guess in truth what country would want to find him except the US just like what country would want to accept his body and the drama that may come with finding him /accepting him for buriel.

                      ORIGINAL: MISTRAD

                      Of course not. But when intelligence agencies are supposed to be looking for something suspicious…this should have been suspicious.

                      The reality is Pakistani intelligence services did not want to find OBL in their country. They never did. If OBL was in the mountains, they had plausible deniability. Here, in a town like this, this is much less believable

                      I guess it is possible that they didn’t know…but that then would ask the question of how incompetent they truly are.

                    • ruszja

                      Member
                      May 2, 2011 at 8:30 pm

                      ORIGINAL: MISTRAD

                      Of course not. But when intelligence agencies are supposed to be looking for something suspicious…this should have been suspicious.

                       
                      Somebody spending some serious coin to build a private compound is not particularly suspicious. It’s a large very diverse country. The idea that the goverment knows about every building or sewer permit is rather quaint.

                      The reality is Pakistani intelligence services did not want to find OBL in their country. They never did. If OBL was in the mountains, they had plausible deniability. Here, in a town like this, this is much less believable

                       
                      Oh they were looking allright, in the mountains.

                    • Unknown Member

                      Deleted User
                      May 2, 2011 at 9:37 pm

                      Pakistan with their intelligence service has already been proven to support the Taliban. Their ISI planned and trained the terrorists implicated Mumbai attack. Without a doubt they knew who was living there. They probably built the place for him themselves. We gave them an out and agreed not to implicate them so everyone could save face. Don’t be so naive.

                    • Unknown Member

                      Deleted User
                      May 2, 2011 at 9:45 pm

                      ORIGINAL: scnsave

                      Pakistan with their intelligence service has already been proven to support the Taliban. Their ISI planned and trained the terrorists implicated in the Bali bombing. Without a doubt they knew who was living there. They probably built the place for him themselves.

                      And the Pakistanis probably used our aid money to do it.

                    • Unknown Member

                      Deleted User
                      May 2, 2011 at 10:04 pm

                      No doubt, why use your own money. Laughed all the way to Warziristan.

                    • Unknown Member

                      Deleted User
                      May 2, 2011 at 10:48 pm

                      I  love that bin laden got double tapped while hiding behind a woman by one of the most badass soldiers on earth.

                      he knew he lost and that he was going to eat american bullets.

                      burn in hell

                    • julie.young_645

                      Member
                      May 2, 2011 at 4:32 am

                      Certainly a great day. However, I have a few questions/observations.

                      1. Body immediately buried at sea to accommodate Islamic law. How long does it take to run DNA analysis?
                      2. Nice compound 100 meters from a military academy. But no one knew who lived there? Sure.
                      3. Announcement perfectly timed to interrupt climactic moment of Trump’s Celebrity Apprentice.

                      I’m thrilled we got the b@st@rd. I [i]hope[/i] we got him…

                    • Unknown Member

                      Deleted User
                      May 2, 2011 at 4:37 am

                      a bit more – from the WH update:

                      We shared our intelligence on this Bin Laden compound with no other country, including Pakistan. That was for one reason and one reason alone: We believed it was essential to the security of the operation and our personnel. In fact, only a very small group of people inside our own government knew of this operation in advance.

                      Shortly after the raid, US officials contacted senior Pakistani leaders to brief them on the intent and the results of the raid. We have also contacted a number of our close allies and partners throughout the world.

                      They obviously knew there were moles inside the Pakstani govt that would blow the whole thing.

                      The Pakistanis are running around trying to save face.

                    • Unknown Member

                      Deleted User
                      May 2, 2011 at 4:38 am

                      ORIGINAL: DoctorDalai

                      Certainly a great day. However, I have a few questions/observations.

                      1. Body immediately buried at sea to accommodate Islamic law. How long does it take to run DNA analysis?
                      2. Nice compound 100 meters from a military academy. But no one knew who lived there? Sure.
                      3. Announcement perfectly timed to interrupt climactic moment of Trump’s Celebrity Apprentice.

                      I’m thrilled we got the b@st@rd. I [i]hope[/i] we got him…

                      I’m pretty sure there are little pieces of OBL in vials somewhere being tested right now. Let’s hope they don’t try to clone him.

                    • Unknown Member

                      Deleted User
                      May 2, 2011 at 4:45 am

                      My first quyestion is how do you build a million dollar compound within a mile of a military base in the middle of no where without the Army knowing anything about it?
                       
                      Uhhhhh You don’t
                       
                      Bin Laden was under the protection of this faction of Pakistans military.
                       
                      Just my 2 cents
                       
                       
                      Just like a mob racket

                    • Unknown Member

                      Deleted User
                      May 2, 2011 at 4:46 am

                      Seems Dalai found it around 100yds from the Pakstani Military academy.

                      Guardian supplies this link

                      http://www.google.com/maps/ms?ie=UTF8&hl=en&msa=0&msid=203896390363274938907.0004a246b8765f9e4fd72&t=h&ll=34.173749,73.235207&spn=0.049708,0.072956&z=13&source=embed

                      so here is the pictures. I love the understated title “A map that raises questions”

                      Oh yes it does

                      [image]local://17576/EE3DB1039D5C4D2A9DCB8E6AE0D78D4C.jpg[/image]

                    • Unknown Member

                      Deleted User
                      May 2, 2011 at 4:47 am

                      one more:

                      [image]local://17576/58210C3A2F99473BBE00EA82211E8FEF.jpg[/image]

                    • waltermfernandesyahoo.com.br

                      Member
                      May 2, 2011 at 4:58 am

                      Our government/ military did it right. Given:
                       
                      a) age of information availability – web
                       
                      b) cultural difference btwn Pakistan and the US and inherent allegiance towards similar faith/ background
                       
                      No one could or should have been trusted.
                       
                      If Pakistan was involved, and they did not tip off the Bin Laden entourage, they would have become targets of retaliation. If they had tipped them off, the US has repeatedly shown them that no consequence would have been suffered.
                       
                      What makes this operation that much more spectacular was the obstacles overcome on mission, helicopter malfunction and subsequent replacement. Clearly these boys have learned from Mogadishu and are true hardcore bada$$es. Very proud of our troops.

                    • palomareeves_533

                      Member
                      May 2, 2011 at 4:51 am

                      Bravo Zulu to the Heroes from the Navy Seal Team. Willing to put their lives on the line anytime,anywhere for each and everyone of us. Today we should all bask in their glory….

                      Tomorrow we can return to Politics…….

                    • Unknown Member

                      Deleted User
                      May 2, 2011 at 4:58 am

                      WOW he was also holed up near a Golf Club
                       
                      Almost like a South Park Skit

                    • jquinones8812_854

                      Member
                      May 2, 2011 at 5:05 am

                      I will never believe that someone in the Pak govt didn’t know about it.

                      Also interesting that the key intelligence was a nickname of Bin Laden’s courier, which was obtained in Gitmo under harsh interrogations. Apparently that happened around 2004, but it took until 2007 to get any idea of that actual identity. They finally pinpointed him last summer, and that led to the compound.

                    • odayjassim1978_476

                      Member
                      May 2, 2011 at 9:54 am

                      imagine that an honorable buriel wrapped in white cloth.
                      they could have let celebrity apprentice play out–the announcement actual came later

                      ORIGINAL: DoctorDalai

                      Certainly a great day. However, I have a few questions/observations.

                      1. Body immediately buried at sea to accommodate Islamic law. How long does it take to run DNA analysis?
                      2. Nice compound 100 meters from a military academy. But no one knew who lived there? Sure.
                      3. Announcement perfectly timed to interrupt climactic moment of Trump’s Celebrity Apprentice.

                      I’m thrilled we got the b@st@rd. I [i]hope[/i] we got him…

                    • GJWELSH

                      Member
                      May 2, 2011 at 11:01 am

                    • Unknown Member

                      Deleted User
                      May 2, 2011 at 11:03 am

                      Obama deserves credit for having caught Osama. He was in fact the captain of the ship and approved the operation. However, he shouldn’t be crowing too much, since the conditions for the capture were set into place long before he came into power.  The information leading to the operation was acquired during the waterboarding interrogations of KDM and Abu Faraj al-Libi in Guantanamo, in Poland and Romania.  These were the same interrogations that Obama decried.  Operations were also made possible by the toppling of the Taliban and the focus of intelligence resourses in Pakistan.  The operation was undertaken by same CIA that Holder tried to prosecute and by the military that Obama is trying to defund, using patience and good detective work.

                      So yes, he deserves credit, but he should be careful not to pat himself on the back too much for the sake of political gain. His record and his words precede him.

                    • Unknown Member

                      Deleted User
                      May 2, 2011 at 11:06 am

                      [b]The information leading to the operation was acquired during the waterboarding interrogations of KDM and Abu Faraj al-Libi in Guantanamo, in Poland and Romania.[/b]
                      [b][/b] 
                      Could you show me where you got this info at?

                    • odayjassim1978_476

                      Member
                      May 2, 2011 at 11:22 am

                      Chester Arthur, our 21st President was plagued with conspiracy theories that he was actually Canadian and not a US citizen.  But, fortunately he was allowed to serve as Vice-President and President and would later be known as the FATHER of civil service.  Publisher Alexander McClure said of Arthur–“No man entered the Presidency so profoundly distrusted and no man retired so generally respected.”

                    • ruszja

                      Member
                      May 2, 2011 at 11:36 am

                      Must have been odd to go to the whitehouse correspondents dinner and crack funny lines about Trump and then return to the next briefing about the impending raid.

                      I remember one line from Set Myers skid (paraphrased): ‘Little known fact, Osama Bin Laden had a show on C-span for the past three years but nobody noticed’

                    • Unknown Member

                      Deleted User
                      May 2, 2011 at 12:11 pm

                      ORIGINAL: kpack123

                      [b]The information leading to the operation was acquired during the waterboarding interrogations of KDM and Abu Faraj al-Libi in Guantanamo, in Poland and Romania.[/b]
                      [b][/b] 
                      Could you show me where you got this info at?

                      http://www.startribune.com/nation/121089124.html

                    • Unknown Member

                      Deleted User
                      May 2, 2011 at 12:59 pm

                      The article never mentions waterboarding
                       
                      Lets at least try to stick to the facts instead of the spin please?

                    • Unknown Member

                      Deleted User
                      May 2, 2011 at 1:30 pm

                      Personally I don’t give all that much credit to either Bush or Obama. I give to the on the ground intelligence that was needed for this to happen and to the military guys that cared it out.

                    • Unknown Member

                      Deleted User
                      May 2, 2011 at 1:42 pm

                      Raddoc

                      I agree as well although I will add that it was probably easier for Obama to send special ops into Pakistan as he is probably less hated by Islamic peoples when compared to bush.

                      But certainly I agree. Score the big victory for the special ops and the intelligence community

                      and as I stated above I think Bush cheney and Rumsfeld did a lot of good work re-organizing our intelligence community so certainly they deserve som praise as well.
                       
                      Mistrad,
                       
                      Sorry but I can’t connect the same dots as you are tryig to connect.

                    • jquinones8812_854

                      Member
                      May 2, 2011 at 2:34 pm

                      ORIGINAL: kpack123

                      Raddoc

                      I agree as well although I will add that it was probably easier for Obama to send special ops into Pakistan as he is probably less hated by Islamic peoples when compared to bush.

                      But certainly I agree. Score the big victory for the special ops and the intelligence community

                      and as I stated above I think Bush cheney and Rumsfeld did a lot of good work re-organizing our intelligence community so certainly they deserve som praise as well.

                      Mistrad,

                      Sorry but I can’t connect the same dots as you are tryig to connect.

                      Kpack,

                      I don’t think there are any dots to follow.

                      It is clearly stated that harsh interrogations were critical for the information. Even Obama people are leaking that this is the case. However, waterboarding may or may not be included in that definition, and I have not seen any confirmation that it was used.

                      That is the beginning and end of my statement.

                      I don’t know if this really matters at all, other than historical perspective frankly, It may validate some of Bush’s actions; but Obama will never use those interrogations again, even if it was effective.

                    • Unknown Member

                      Deleted User
                      May 2, 2011 at 2:47 pm

                      No matter how you feel about him, you gotta admit that Obama has had a good week. He dispatched that national nightmare with the swirly thingy atop his head. And he also killed Bin Laden.

                    • jquinones8812_854

                      Member
                      May 2, 2011 at 3:20 pm

                      ORIGINAL: stir22

                      No matter how you feel about him, you gotta admit that Obama has had a good week. He dispatched that national nightmare with the swirly thingy atop his head. And he also killed Bin Laden.

                      LOL.

                      Politically, Trump may be the biggest winner…no one is paying attention to him getting pilloried at the correspondents dinner on Saturday.

                    • Unknown Member

                      Deleted User
                      May 2, 2011 at 2:49 pm

                      ORIGINAL: Raddocmed

                      Personally I don’t give all that much credit to either Bush or Obama. I give to the on the ground intelligence that was needed for this to happen and to the military guys that cared it out.

                      Who do you think put the ground intelligence and military there with such a directive in the first place?
                      Do you give Columbus any credit for discovering America, or do you only credit his crew?

                    • jquinones8812_854

                      Member
                      May 2, 2011 at 1:34 pm

                      ORIGINAL: kpack123

                      [b]The information leading to the operation was acquired during the waterboarding interrogations of KDM and Abu Faraj al-Libi in Guantanamo, in Poland and Romania.[/b]
                      [b][/b] 
                      Could you show me where you got this info at?

                      There are many links that say that Khalid Shekh Mumhammed is the primary source of this information.

                      We also know from documents that KSM did not talk at all before waterboarding. That is a documented fact.

                      Now, whether this specific information came as a direct result of waterboarding…I don’t know, and I have not seen anything definitive. I think it is safe to say, however, that the information would not have come about without harsh interrogations of some sort. Leon Panetta implied as much today, FYI…but again, did not say it outright.

                    • jquinones8812_854

                      Member
                      May 2, 2011 at 1:38 pm

                      Oh, and just to be sure, confirmation that ‘harsh interrogations’ were key to the information..again, waterboarding is NOT specifically mentioned.

                      http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2011/05/02/501364/main20058859.shtml

                    • Unknown Member

                      Deleted User
                      May 2, 2011 at 11:52 am

                      ORIGINAL: aldadoc

                      Obama deserves credit for having caught Osama. He was in fact the captain of the ship and approved the operation. However,[b] he shouldn’t be crowing too much, since the conditions for the capture were set into place long before he came into power.[/b]  The information leading to the operation was acquired during the waterboarding interrogations of KDM and Abu Faraj al-Libi in Guantanamo, in Poland and Romania.  These were the same interrogations that Obama decried.  Operations were also made possible by the toppling of the Taliban and the focus of intelligence resourses in Pakistan.  The operation was undertaken by same CIA that Holder tried to prosecute and by the military that Obama is trying to defund, using patience and good detective work.

                      So yes, he deserves credit, but he should be careful not to pat himself on the back too much for the sake of political gain. His record and his words precede him.

                      I’d like to go on record for disagreeing with you. If the intention of the previous administration really was to do the ground work to capture/kill bin Laden, then Bush would have been busy looking for him instead of announcing to the entire planet that he (and by inference, the USA) wasn’t that interested in bin Laden and doesn’t think about him that much any more.

                      It is not a partisan thing to say “Obama should absolutely be crowing and patting himself on the back and so should everyone else”. He should be commended for the courage to escalate in Afghanistan and especially in Pakistan whose gov’t was growing soft on the USA and where things were starting to get pretty confrontational. Also, in the midst of such a lousy economy, Obama took a tremendous chance escalating the expensive occupancy in those two countries, and he took a big chance publicly announcing his intention to track down al Qaeda and bin Laden (contrary to Bush), thereby giving the bad guys enough notice to relocate into the cracks if they thought there was any chance of getting smoked out by Pakistani stool pigeons. Putting so many eggs into the Afghanistan/Pakistan basket during an election year was an extremely risky thing to do politically, albeit the extremely appropriate thing to do with respect to serving the American people by bringing transgressors of the USA to justice.

                      Having said that, I fully expect Trump and Taitz to start oozing vengeful skepticism about bin Laden’s death to the extreme of vehemently decrying any photographic/video evidence as being merely flagrant digital forgery. [i]”Isn’t it so convenient that there is no body, whose DNA did you compare his to, show us the lab reports”[/i], and on and on and on…

                    • odayjassim1978_476

                      Member
                      May 2, 2011 at 11:04 am

                      given the stress of knowing and executing the operation, Trump may have actually provided the President some comic relief with his blustering.
                      Gaddafi take note as Hades engulfs Osama.

                      [image]local://3872/AB3D30C32DE74D9E84055F8F46531B51.jpg[/image]

                    • Unknown Member

                      Deleted User
                      May 2, 2011 at 7:47 am

                      ORIGINAL: Dr.Sardonicus
                      Implying that Bush was asleep at the wheel. Probably the first time anyone has accused GWB of being a slacker when it came to military affairs.

                      Just proof that politician is a lifetime diagnosis, and incurable.

                      [i]”Implying”[/i]?
                      [i]”Probably the first time…”[/i]?
                      Where have you been for the past 10 years?

                      The “backhand” was well-deserved. Bush should be backslapped early and often by “incurable” politicians for generations to come for stating that he no longer was interested that much in bin Laden — that he didn’t pay much attention to him anymore.

                      Congratulations to our troops for a job well done, and to Obama for focusing on bringing bin Laden to justice for murdering thousands of innocent men and women.

            • odayjassim1978_476

              Member
              May 26, 2011 at 7:27 pm

              Musharraf on Piers Morgan tonite basically shows YES the US did the right thing by not informing the Paki government of the operation.. He says that had he known when he was in office that he would have played that card to get something in return but would not have handed him over to US forces and let Paki military handle it.  The crime was on US soil and why should we give you something to help you in politics and give aid and still not have possession of Osama.
               
               

              ORIGINAL: BarelyPassed

              ORIGINAL: vonbraun

              If he was near Islamisbad, the pakistanis have been jerking us around for 10 years.

              <sarcasm> Gee, what gave you that idea? </sarcasm>

  • Unknown Member

    Deleted User
    May 2, 2011 at 6:32 am

    so we got UBL on a tip interrogating prisoners in [b]GITMO[/b], something obama promised in his campaign to do away with (both the interrogations and gitmo), which led us to a mansion in [b]PAKISTAN[/b] where he was being sheltered by our ‘allies.’

    this is either ironic or just plain stupid.

    at least the bastard can rot in hell now.

    • Unknown Member

      Deleted User
      May 2, 2011 at 7:04 am

      May his soul provide unquenchable fuel for the hot flames of hell. I hope he experiences the painful intensity of this heat for all eternity… the miserable SOB.

      • jquinones8812_854

        Member
        May 2, 2011 at 7:17 am

        Bruce, I didn’t mean to make it political actually, just stating a fact. Ultimately, Obama deserves all the credit in the world…he basically pulled the trigger.

      • Unknown Member

        Deleted User
        May 2, 2011 at 7:19 am

        I find it amazing that anyone would think that Pakistan does NOT support and protect terrorists.
         
        Ask India about the state sponsered terrorism from Pakistan.

        • jquinones8812_854

          Member
          May 2, 2011 at 7:23 am

          ORIGINAL: macrophallus

          I find it amazing that anyone would think that Pakistan does NOT support and protect terrorists.

          Ask India about the state sponsered terrorism from Pakistan.

          Obama is playing this right….I think they know for sure that Pakistan knew where OBL was and kept it quiet. But he doesn’t want to damage them.

          Pakistan is basically a terrorist state; we should not forget that.

          • Unknown Member

            Deleted User
            May 2, 2011 at 7:31 am

            ORIGINAL: MISTRAD

            Pakistan knew where OBL was and kept it quiet.

            Pakistan is basically a terrorist state; we should not forget that.

            i’ve always questioned the wisdom of cooperating with pakistan for this exact reason, and now we just happen to find bin laden holed up (no pun intended) in their country.

            it just seems counterproductive to have an ‘ally’ in the war on terror with a nation that is feeding us false information and funding/sheltering the terrorists. the hardcore cynic in me wonders if the pakistanis led us to UBL because they felt that he was becoming a liability even to them.

      • Unknown Member

        Deleted User
        May 2, 2011 at 7:52 am

        ORIGINAL: clyde toris

        May his soul provide unquenchable fuel for the hot flames of hell. I hope he experiences the painful intensity of this heat for all eternity… the miserable SOB.

        I wish it were so, but, sadly, I believe he is simply unconscious. BUT – There is hope – maybe you are right.

  • btomba_77

    Member
    April 30, 2021 at 3:21 pm

     
     
    10 years ago – Bin Laden killed
    [hr]

    There’s a fascinating article in [i]Politico[/i] about the planning of the Bin Laden mission, which occurred ten years ago tomorrow. [link=https://www.politico.com/news/magazine/2021/04/30/osama-bin-laden-death-white-house-oral-history-484793]Id Never Been Involved in Anything as Secret as This – POLITICO[/link]

    JOHN BRENNAN, [i]White House homeland security and counterterrorism adviser[/i]: Leon would come down [to the White House] and give us some additional details and walk through what they what they knowmore about the courier himself, what they knew about his relationship with bin Laden over the years, what they had heard from some of the detainees at Guantanamo about this individual. It continued in October, November, December.

    TOM DONILON: Along the way, my role was to press hard on questions and test the case, which we did during many, many meetings over the course of the next eight months.

    LETITIA LONG: We red-teamed the heck out of it. You think about the other folks like Khalid Sheikh Mohammed and Abu Faraj al-Libbi who were in settled areas of Pakistan and bin Laden just hadnt shown up anywhere else. Based on what we had, I was fairly confident. We were not able to come up with a better alternativeI dont mean another place, I mean a better alternative than bin Laden in this compound.

    LEON PANETTA: There just was not that conclusive piece of evidence. It was essentially there was this family, there was this individual who was walking in circles, there were the couriers.

    JON DARBY: It was a combination of little things. Thats what intelligence isputting together jigsaw puzzle pieces to come up with a story to explain the situation.

    [link]https://youtu.be/YbrwIE_GhrM[/link]

  • btomba_77

    Member
    April 4, 2022 at 3:31 am

    GOP Congresswoman during the Trump rally in Michigan – giving full credit to  President Trump for having “Caught Osama Bin Laden”.

    ___
     

    [i]While President Trump was in office, we didnt have a war, and I think he made three peace treaties, McClain said. Caught Osama bin Laden and [Qasem] Soleimani, [Abu Bakr] al-Baghdadi.[/i]

    [link=https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/redirect-to/?redirect=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.mediaite.com%2Fpolitics%2Fwatch-gop-congresswoman-incorrectly-attributes-bin-laden-killing-to-trump%2F]https://www.mediaite.com/politics/wa…ling-to-trump/[/link]

    • btomba_77

      Member
      August 1, 2022 at 4:37 pm

      U.S. kills al Qaeda leader Ayman al-Zawahri in drone strike

      The strike that killed Al Qaeda leader Ayman al-Zawahiri is a major success of U.S. counter-terrorism efforts.

      • btomba_77

        Member
        August 1, 2022 at 4:39 pm

        Trump spent the weekend snuggling up to the folks who financed Al-Qaeda (while the deplorables chanted Brandon in the background) while Biden was busy snuffing out bad guys.

  • btomba_77

    Member
    August 2, 2022 at 5:47 am

    Some backstory pieces:
     
    [link=https://www.nytimes.com/2022/08/01/us/politics/al-qaeda-strike-afghanistan.html]New York Times[/link]: The early-morning strike in the heart of downtown Kabul over the weekend capped a 21-year manhunt for an Egyptian radical who more than anyone besides Bin Laden was deemed responsible for the deadliest foreign attack on the United States in modern times and never gave up targeting Americans. Often seen sitting by Bin Ladens side with his gray beard and fierce scowl, al-Zawahri, 71, never achieved the same global notoriety as the terrorist mastermind but was widely considered the intellectual force behind Al Qaeda.
     
    [link=https://apnews.com/article/al-qaida-biden-ayman-zawahri-covid-health-595c6bda6d17fdd0c1c936137fe1e7c6]Associated Press[/link]: His family, supported by the Haqqani Taliban network, had taken up residence in the home after the Taliban regained control of the country last year, following the withdrawal of U.S. forces after nearly 20 years of combat that had been intended, in part, to keep al-Qaida from regaining a base of operations in Afghanistan.
     
    [link=https://www.cnn.com/2022/08/01/politics/ayman-al-zawahiri-death-white-house-joe-biden/index.html]CNN[/link]: Throughout the months-long effort to plan this weekends strike, Biden repeatedly tasked his officials with ensuring civilians including members of Zawahiris family werent killed. None were, according to the White House.
     

    • kaldridgewv2211

      Member
      August 2, 2022 at 7:27 pm

      It was also a missile that didnt explode but fanned out blades. Hope it chopped him right in half.