[william.wang_997]

I suggest B if the location is optimal and SO agrees/happier.

[btomba_77]

Job A and Job B otherwise equal for location, call, stability etc, I’ll take the PP gig with more $ and time off and only a marginal increase in RVU productivity expectation.
 
2k extra RVUs for an extra 150k ish comp, but topping out around 13k peak and 3-4 more weeks off  … sounds pretty nice to me.
 
 
 

[luciairegui]

Agree it does sound good. However it also sounds like RVUs keep climbing up due to understaffing but I haven’t gotten any details. Would it still be good if the requirements go up to 14-15k?. Also I am not sure what the buy-in is for that group and there’s a part of me that struggles to put in 2 years of partnership track, plus possibly a big buy in. Golden handcuffs basically. But it does seem like a stable group.

[mthx9155]

Are weekend shift requirements similar frequency and intensity for all 3 groups? 

[g.giancaspro_108]

Not really enough information to make any kind of decision here, but if you are a partner in a PP group you can make the decision to hire more as needed.  As an employee you will either be told “read more” or they will hire, but you will not have the ability to make that decision for yourself.
 
Are you experienced or coming out of training?  That may affect your ability to negotiate the partnership track to something shorter.  If looking at partnerships, don’t worry too much about the pay during that employee year, consider the job based on the partner conditions.
 
IMO to adequately compare these jobs you need to know not only the wRVU and exam type breakdown but the hours, the call schedule, intensity, other obligations (committees, tumor boards, etc).
 
What region are you in?  600k for 13k wRVU is only $46/wRVU so I hope this is a desirable area.

[Unknown Member]

Quote from sandeep panga

Not really enough information to make any kind of decision here, but if you are a partner in a PP group you can make the decision to hire more as needed.  As an employee you will either be told “read more” or they will hire, but you will not have the ability to make that decision for yourself.

Are you experienced or coming out of training?  That may affect your ability to negotiate the partnership track to something shorter.  If looking at partnerships, don’t worry too much about the pay during that employee year, consider the job based on the partner conditions.

IMO to adequately compare these jobs you need to know not only the wRVU and exam type breakdown but the hours, the call schedule, intensity, other obligations (committees, tumor boards, etc).

What region are you in?  600k for 13k wRVU is only $46/wRVU so I hope this is a desirable area.

with 20% overhead they would be collecting 60 rvu, 90th percentile, so likely not be a desirable area. Exception would be bay area, Portland OR or ME, Boise, ID, IA, WI, MN, few others.
 
pps making 600 are probably doing 15-18 k per rad. Some will have to hit higher numbers to support IR.

[zoranaciricmd_377]

B

[Unknown Member]

Sounds like a great deal to me. Midsize city making around 400K for 18K per year………

[Unknown Member]

Quote from TTL

Another one I’d like to get the AM braintrust’s input on…

Happy to have 3 decent options here but struggling to fully decide. I like the idea of private practice more but over the past few years the trend in my region seems to be that the partners are working much harder due to shortstaffing. Employed comes with its own set of problems.

Job A (PP)
– Low to mid 3s on track (2 year). Not sure about buy-in yet but partners make in the high 5-low 6 range.
– 8-10 weeks vacation, 12 weeks as partner
– Little more travel between sites. Not much advanced imaging
– Not sure of RVU reqs but word was closer to 12-13k

Job B (employed)
– High 4s
– 8-9 weeks vacation
– 10-11k RVU
– Get the vibe that there is a little more quality to this group, residency, more higher end subspecialty imaging/clinicians

Job C (PP)
– Mid 3s on track (1 year), 25k signing bonus. Partners make in the 5-6 range.
– 8-10 weeks vacation, 12 weeks as partner
– 11-12k RVU
– Most travel, location is suboptimal

PPs are calculating rvus and sharing with candidates now? Is this a new thing? 
 

[abd.fawzi_217]

It seems insane to join a PP if you don’t know the average RVU…?

[Unknown Member]

Quote from boggles

It seems insane to join a PP if you don’t know the average RVU…?

You know what they say, if you have to ask how much it is you can’t afford it. Don’t worry about the volume. If others can do it so can you.

[Unknown Member]

Groups usually give shift averages or say they are high volume or lifestyle (low volume) practices.

[Dvgit]

All three jobs look terrible. Starting in the 3s is a no go.

[luciairegui]

Personally value lifestyle more than money especially at that tax bracket. Worried about the golden handcuffs of PP if I ever want to move, but employed can suck too.
 
I asked for RVU reqs. If a group is not willing to share a ballpark that is a red flag for me. But I do know all of those will probably go up at some point.
 
Most of the jobs I looked at that started in the 4-5 range with upside were either PE or in undesirable locations. I’m sure they are out there.

[Unknown Member]

agree   all 3 sound bad.
as a partner u should be well over 600     no call   no weekends 

[luciairegui]

What locations would this be in? I don’t know any people in a situation like this in major metros. Any groups I should be looking at?

[smfst7_929]

PP. If volume increases you make more or hire someone

[mgmacielendocrino_912]

Quote from drad123

Quote from boggles

It seems insane to join a PP if you don’t know the average RVU…?

You know what they say, if you have to ask how much it is you can’t afford it. Don’t worry about the volume. If others can do it so can you.

Not true at all…have you never met someone who left or was kicked out of a group/not offered a partnership b/c they couldn’t read enough volume?

[abd.fawzi_217]

Not about if others can do it or not, but if you don’t know the RVUs and salary you can’t calculate your $/RVU which seems to be the best way of calculating your actual rate.

[Unknown Member]

not enough info for me to pick. I think a lot of people would be happiest looking at :
 
#1 Location you and your spouse really want
#2 Reasonableness of the day to day work , i.e. are you exhausted by the end of the day or doing well. 
#3 Vacation amount and ability to arrange for individual days off here and there with a month’s notice or less
#4 Money

[luciairegui]

This is good advice. Location unfortunately seems a little anticorrelated to the job quality but that’s expected.
 
The employed gig seems to be the best work/life balance, although without much autonomy and not the same level of upside as PP. There are some extra shift opportunities at all places but honestly I would probably only dabble in them as I value spending time with my family. I don’t feel like my life would be singificantly different making 6 vs 5. Some of the partners in the two PPs seemed fine working more due to understaffing and making a ton of $$, some were kind of annoyed and borderline desperate for more help because they were putting in a lot more time than they used to.
 

[Unknown Member]

Location is complicated.
There are a lot of nice places to live. The preoccupation with specific cities is ironically provincial.
A great job opens up all sorts of great possibilities in life.
A mediocre job in a great location is overrated.

Of course being close to family is another complicating factor. But the most important family is your wife and kids; they are the core of most our existence. If they are cool with a location, it will be ok.

[luciairegui]

Spoken to a few other coresidents who are looking in other areas.
 
Not finding this mythical 600+, no call, no weekends unless you are willing to take no vacation or live in BFE. No spouses (or the rads I’m talking about for that matter) are willing to live there.
 
Most jobs coming out to about 40-50 per wRVU in the metros. Low to mid 50s in decent PP or employed gigs.

[Unknown Member]

Quote from TTL

Spoken to a few other coresidents who are looking in other areas.

Not finding this mythical 600+, no call, no weekends unless you are willing to take no vacation or live in BFE. No spouses (or the rads I’m talking about for that matter) are willing to live there.

Most jobs coming out to about 40-50 per wRVU in the metros. Low to mid 50s in decent PP or employed gigs.

Care to share more details on these mythical low to mid 50s wrvu pp or employed jobs?

[Unknown Member]

I still don’t know how pps are telling candidates wrvu comp numbers. How do the groups even calculate them?

[afazio.uk_887]

 
Bro – none of these options sound that good.  
 
But – I would advise going for a more lifestyle gig.  
 
Rads is a very fun field when the workload is reasonable IMO. 
 
Best of luck. 

[alex.nieto_484]

Quote from drad123

I still don’t know how pps are telling candidates wrvu comp numbers. How do the groups even calculate them?

 
lots of groups send out the RVU on a monthly or quarterly basis. at the end of the year you know how many RVUs you generated and how much money you made

[Unknown Member]

Quote from RadCog

Quote from drad123

I still don’t know how pps are telling candidates wrvu comp numbers. How do the groups even calculate them?

lots of groups send out the RVU on a monthly or quarterly basis. at the end of the year you know how many RVUs you generated and how much money you made

Are these groups paying by rvu? Care to name a group that gives out this info?

[satyanar]

Quote from drad123

Quote from TTL

Spoken to a few other coresidents who are looking in other areas.

Not finding this mythical 600+, no call, no weekends unless you are willing to take no vacation or live in BFE. No spouses (or the rads I’m talking about for that matter) are willing to live there.

Most jobs coming out to about 40-50 per wRVU in the metros. Low to mid 50s in decent PP or employed gigs.

Care to share more details on these [b]mythical[/b] low to mid 50s wrvu pp or employed jobs?

 
This has been explained to you over and over. Still don’t get it?

[Unknown Member]

well I’m in BFE by choice.   plenty of bfe jobs